Patterner

Since a tree is so very different from us, its subjective experience of itself is very different from our subjective experience of ourselves. Which is...

I am attempting to have conversations about it, in the hopes of gaining any degree of understanding. It is appealing because, despite being able to de...

I don't know if I'm understanding you. Are you thinking there is a physical mechanism for consciousness within us, and we would be able to see it if o...

No, I don't think we do. I've never heard of any self repairing, non-living system. Not sure what that would even look like.

I think non physicalism is the explanation because physicalism is not. Consciousness is non physical. That's why, despite having learned some pretty i...

I'm not sure about that. How can you be aware without experiencing?

Nicely said. So it's functional structure that is emergent? Top-Down causation?

Without having ever read anything on the topic, I was a physicalist up until several years ago. I had never heard of the terms physicalism or material...

Bad wording on my part. I think consciousness is always the same, and can always be causal. But the conscious thing in question has to be up to the ta...

Perhaps the subjective experience of information processing systems of sufficient number and/or complexity is awareness. And when sufficient feedback ...

No, that's not it. I don't see consciousness as being processes of being alive, mental processes, or anything. I see it as nothing but subjective expe...

I would think it either is, or is not. I don't understand how it could be an illusion. I do not see it this way. My thinking is that consciousness is ...

Agreed. I do not think it is a misstep. Is it or is it not an objective fact that we're all subjectively conscious? Just because neither of our first-...

Not sure what you mean. What example of yours would I be countering? Just curious. I'm not looking to counter you. I'm just wondering how you would me...

And I disagree. I'm willing to believe we are all conscious. Just because I can't know your instance of consciousness doesn't mean I won't accept that...

You interpret it that way. I interpret it that physical is not all there is to reality. I understand the physical we experience every moment isn't exa...

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Can you elaborate? How do you measure the effect consciousness has on everything else? What's the method, or procedure? Which sense, or what tool, is ...

Sorry. I didn't mean you. I meant people in general, as a result of "Galileo's Error".

I like the snippet. Wish his books didn't cost so much.

Ain't it the truth. Materialism. Physicalism. Naturalism. Nagel even says 'I will use the terms “materialism” or “materialist naturalism” to refer to ...

It certainty is. Another way of looking at it is that I don't think we have any justification for saying reality contains only the things we have disc...

But what is the Hard Problem?

If consciousness is fundamental, then we can't measure it in the ways we measure everything else. It's not physical, and all of our methods of detecti...

The HPoC is explaining why the altered brain states alter the person's subjective experience. Why do brain states have subjective experience at all? T...

We can answer these questions. We can explain these things, at least in terms of properties of particles. Negatively charged electrons, electron shell...

We cannot account for every molecule of air in a room, but we do fine measuring things like temperature and air pressure. And the temperature and pres...

It's not a matter of not being able to experience what someone/thing else experiences. The puzzle is why anything has any subjective experience at all...

His point is that, although the properties can be measured with Precision, but we do not know what that are. We could not know what proto-consciousnes...

I am not trying to "make consciousness something non-physical." Consciousness is non-physical. I'm interested in this particular hypothesis. I present...

I'm asking if anyone has an example of strong emergence. For those who think consciousness is, I'm wondering if there are others.

I agree. But I don't think all properties are physical.

For those who think consciousness is an example of strong emergence, are there any other examples?

I gotcha. And I agree, although I don't suspect you would agree with the reason I agree. I think consciousness and thinking/mental are entirely differ...

I don't know how you mean by this. In what way can anyone specify what they think is the answer to the HPoC? Surely proto-consciousness is not far les...

Don't forget about property dualism. :grin: Matter has a non-physical property. Is there any need for the word "mental"?

No, I am not. I think there must be quite a bit more to an entity than just the one kind of mental ability for it to have an agent-like status, regard...

My point was that an abacus does not process information, and is therefore not a unit in regards to consciousness (according to the idea I'm discussin...

not sure what I'm doing wrong with that. The link is: https://meridian.allenpress.com/aplm/article/141/5/619/194217/AlphaGo-Deep-Learning-and-the-Futu...

Yes, computers are physical systems. But an abacus is not a computer. It can't process information unless you give it a power system and add the rules...

Could you do that without giving it a power system and adding the rules so the abacus would manipulate the beads correctly?

A Paul Davies quote seems appropriate, although I don't know if it helps any. From The Demon in the Machine:

I don't suspect an abacus is a conscious unit. While I suspect consciousness is everywhere, in all things, I don't think everything that humans view a...

Yet another reply is that consciousness is fundamental, already there in the LLM. But the LLM does not have enough information processing systems and ...

Or Beethoven composing music after going deaf.

Louis CK says he hates when people say "The N-word." Not the actual word, but "the N-word." Because you're intentionally putting the word into someone...

Stand and Deliver is a really good movie. Here's the scene where he talks about 0 and negative numbers. But yeah, I doubt anybody ever thought of that...

I assumed RogueAI meant an observer with some mental abilities, perhaps even humans. But if considering things your way, then perhaps the answer to th...

Thank you. I wouldn't fight you on your alternative proposal. I see the value in knowing that when someone uses the word "consciousness", they mean so...

DNA is never naturally found outside of its special little environment. Taking it out is doing something to prevent its natural function - synthesizin...