khaled

intuition and introspection seem to be important yes. The other two not so much. Never heard of a scientist who didn't use their intuition to come up ...

All just seem like tools in a toolbox to me.

Sure. Definitely those exist too. I realized I was mistaken when you pointed it out a long time ago. Some words just don’t have referents or definitio...

:up: For me that's also the case with idealism.

You'd first have to tell me what a "mental aspect" is because everyone seems to be using it but I don't get what it is. If you mean something like con...

Well you can define physical things so as to include it. That's usually how physicalism continues. At first "physical things" were rocks and such, the...

Fantastic. Thanks for clarifying. That's exactly what I meant when I said "The experience of red cups includes what people call red cups" but I can se...

Sure but I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. Anyways I have to run now. I edited my last comment a bit hopefully that makes it clearer. Go...

Let me rephrase. Here you say "includes red cups". And also you say: Therefore what I call "red" may not be what you call "red" correct? Therefore whe...

Not afterlife but I'm not sure about "idealist". I never got the split between idealism and materialism. They both just seemed to be using different w...

Here you emphasize that the experience (colour-wise) produced by the red cup can be different. So let me just call the experience of a red cup you hav...

Because it has a certain meaning. When people argue "qualia doesn't exist" it makes it seem as though they are saying experience doesn't exist. As I s...

Well considering I wrote it that won’t accomplish much. If you’re confused about something quote it, ask about it, do something specific.

Say what you mean. What’s confusing?

do you have a habit of reading the first line in a comment and not reading the rest? Go back and check yourself. You’ll find I said what I mean. You l...

come on now. You know what I meant. Identical as in you can’t tell the difference from a first person perspective.

Well the problem is that you’re quining Qualia while literally using it under a different name “experience”. What you mean by “the experience of red c...

I meant it as you meant it here: Read the latest reply for detail.

So what are they and how does one differentiate? If the experience is identical but in one there is a red cup in the other there is a drawing of a red...

Then what you call “experience” we call “Qualia” That somehow you can think you’re experiencing something while actually you’re not experiencing anyth...

Yes. Generally if something cannot be described fully without experiencing it then it refers to the experience. You can describe an apple in a fruit b...

How come then that the word “red” preceded any understanding of light? And the word “bitter” preceded any atomic theory? I don’t see how these words c...

There just so happens to be a panpsychism thread pretty active right now. But what I would consider the best argument is that it is a simpler view. Th...

Again, can't speak for him. We just have to wait until he answers. I gave it a guess.

How do we teach children what "red" is? We point at red things correct? We do not teach them the electrochemical impulses that are happening in brains...

The symbols are to point at certain parts of the experience. It is to be able to talk about that experience of seeing a colour. That is different from...

Just something that's been bugging me since our discussion because I forgot to add it: Incorrect. Using the word "pain" when trying to describe to som...

It's what I got from Banno. I assumed you were both arguing in the same style. So let me get this straight: There are no Qualia, but there are experie...

Why? I have a ready explanation: Because he’d never had that experience before. The experience being that thing in the box. And no amount of describin...

Because there is something extra that they will always be missing with those explanations. Which is why when colorblind people see color for the first...

Right. I know they call it red. That’s it. I don’t see how that’s the case. I know that their experience consists of what they call red cups. That’s g...

But to say “I do not know what’s in your box” (private) also makes sense. One can divide through by the thing in the box. One can also not. It makes s...

Not necessarily. Check my discussion with Banno about this. It is possible for us to be having a different experience and to still have no communicati...

Private: I do not know what you’re experiencing when seeing a red cup. As long as we both call it red that’s fine. Again: Private would mean: I do not...

It’s really weird to me that y’all are fine with “experience” but not fine with “Qualia” So first off everyone here (except Isaac) has said that peopl...

I didn’t say they were. But what is imagination without a phenomenological layer, still? Because without a phenomenological layer I don’t see how you ...

Fair enough.

The point is that I still don’t think it makes any sense. And I don’t see where they addressed the point. I’ll go scouring later but a link or a few q...

Ok sure but you still haven’t explained some of the things you said. Like how even if the light entering your eye has the wavelength which is typicall...

The point is adding that middle man there. Call it whatever you want. So in the color altering the device + speech altering device example, the person...

The middle man. The X and Y. That’s what Qualia is. And introducing it is what allows people to first understand words such as “red” “bitter” and “pai...

Correct. Now what’s the difference? Assume I do not understand what the word “pain” means. What does it mean to be in pain vs to not be in pain in the...

And what is the difference exactly? In both cases the outward action is identical. Given that there is no way to tell whether or not someone is in pai...

I’m just about to go to bed right now so a few questions about what you’re saying: What does this mean “talk about experience as a subject matter in i...

Does not lead to: And I don't see how it has much to do with it. What is a fait accompli here is that people feel that they have been wronged and have...

Or you can ask Amy who is not a thought experiment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpi1xKD20dw&ab_channel=CatherineArnold

Smells like a private ineffable experience which cannot be known by knowing the brain processes occuring as one experiences it to me.

Please quote the full sentence. I said that’s the worst case scenario. As in even if we couldn't test for coloblindness we would still be able to imag...

And yet there is a difference. That’s the key. We can imagine both possibilities (we can imagine stubbornly refusing to use the right words while seei...

Well when asking a colorblind person “What color is the traffic light?” and they reply “The same color as the sky” or something are they making a stat...