schopenhauer1

Why do you think that is the case?

@"litewave", @"javra" @"Hillary" @"Joshs" @"Paine" And when linked to the idea of p-zombies, it may not be a necessity to have "what it's like" aspect...

Right, so any worker happy with their work is unalienated?

So can you explain?

You must explain these neologisms but without using other neologisms.

The thing of the inner sensations of "what it's like" is the thing to be explained. Evolution giving rise to "what it's like" doesn't explain why ther...

This is exactly the thing I am asking for you all to help with! :razz:

Good, cause you would then have to answer what an unalienated worker looks like. I don't think you had a good answer anyways. Cause there is none.

Or what? Kill yourself.. is the implication. Real fuckn moral.. Any better philosophy or just platitudes akin to something you get in a parenting maga...

What do you think an "unalienated worker" even looks like? You think office workers under the leadership of the "proletariat" and factory workers, and...

Exactly what you can't do against the agenda I speak of. Can't say, "not interested". Imagine if you had to debate me at least every workday for at le...

Just replace bougeoisie with the conditions of life itself. You can throw a snarky fit all you want, but Marx or any other economic theory doesn't "so...

I said: You are not immune from this forced situation. Imagine telling the proletariat. So they are either exploited or not. If they are not, then you...

Until you sort out the problem of forced production en total you have solved nothing but rearranging an already bad system (that is life itself requir...

Yes, we do need to talk about it. Perhaps it at least builds empathy in the fact that we all need to run around and produce because, excepting death, ...

And here is the problem.. No Marxism or Capitalism or Anarchism or any ISM (except antinatalism) gets rid of this initial injustice which all others c...

Is there something about being in a position that one must do X for their survival that is callous or problematic? Is simply "do good at your job" at ...

It's not a hard and fast law, no. That's the point. We have to make it so by motivating ourselves or integrating X, Y, Z ideas about work and accompli...

But one cannot freely choose not to work.. or at least, one cannot expand this maxim universally without collapsing life itself.. So it is life itself...

Houses/homes, clothes, water, electricity.. and all the things that come out of it.. all the things used to maintain what you then have.. it's a snowb...

Ok, kind of on board... That's the problem. There is no freeing from the production-system other than romanticized notions of Robinson Crusoe hacking ...

If you're talking about some sort of asceticism, that is at the extremes that are pretty inaccessible for most people. It's a romanticized version of ...

How is it we have a relationship with the cosmos?

And yet you have not justified it, just asserted it. If you had any charitable reading or care then perhaps you would see the distinct issues: As I sa...

But this is exactly the negative condition and moral problem I'm talking about.. No production suicide.. So we must be producers... Bringing in existe...

So what I mean by rebelling here is more about a stance or a framework to see things. Humans always have to self-impose complying, even if tacitly. No...

Life is the broader category. Human life represents a socioeconomic game. Not a particular kind but a game nonetheless (hunting-gathering, industriali...

But did the punishment fit the crime? Was the punishment just? The most insidious kind of thing is to make the person believe that it is their fault f...

Hey, we actually agree on this. What is it about this self-imposition? Can you elaborate your thoughts on the fact that we don't just "do", but we hav...

Do you think because something is intractable that makes it impervious to moral judgement? If so, why?

Um, isn't this exactly what I am speaking against? Comply...or die.. Is that wrong to put someone into that bind? It is intractable, but is it wrong.

So you are camp Comply or Die is a-ok, what a surprise. And more worthwhile is surely about something in the Complying department. The loving options ...

What I stated was a fact: We don't just "do" we must buy into doing. That is an existential thing. That is not just biology (if you mean by this purel...

So I'm going to follow the logic where it leads and not where I want it to go, unlike you all. The Pessimism lens finds the intractable negative/immor...

Not sure what this means. Philosophy is about trying to figure out what is the case. Is it the case that forcing people to produce (or die) is callous...

And this point above is key to understand Comply in our context. We choose to work, but we might not have wanted to otherwise.. We really can't do oth...

Maybe... Rather if everyone didn't "pull their weight" with production, what would happen? Indeed there are strong social pressures and internal press...

So I brought up the idea of other animals because truly at least some other animals really can be isolated and live in the present. We do neither. We ...

Paradigm shifts and revolutions don't really change the game. because as you state: Schopenhauer would say that this is equivalent to some dissatisfac...

Fair point. I didn't mean to imply that it is a failure, simply not wanting to play the game. Though, most times it is about being disappointed in or ...

The institution of philosophical discourse.

In a laissez fare system, the land, the resources, etc belongs to private entities and not a group. It’s not all shared like the HG arrangement. Priva...

What happens if people wanted to ban together to form hunting-gathering societies that are not based on private property but on shared property, like ...

Pessimists can have fun. It's not mutually exclusive. Rather, it is recognizing the situation for what it is, that we are put in the agenda in the fir...

So you refused to tell me what to study from the Pali Canon. If you can't at least give me a few concepts without telling me to read the whole thing, ...

Hey, that is the gist of the game of life too! But there's no getting off of this merry-go-round.

I think first you must get a handle on what I mean by “comply” before you fit your scheme within its structure.

This doesn’t evade comply or die. It simply makes the choice starker. No middle man.

You can comply or die. It’s up to you. That’s all I’m seeing. Just better tools to comply.

Yet you say stuff like this: Mine as well come from an HR seminar of how to be a better worker. And this truly would be doubling down on the game. Not...