schopenhauer1

Good point

If work is defined by maintenance (of survival, comfort, boredom)- it is creating situations where people must maintain their well-being where there w...

It is a position that giving someone work is always an intrinsic bad. In the intra-worldly affairs of living, it cannot be helped. Our whole survival,...

This is about the gift being not a gift correct.

Nope, it's about not giving OTHER people the "gift" (sarcastic quotes) of MAINTAINING a lifetime's worth of work (survival, comfort, boredom regulatio...

So life takes MAINTENANCE- survival, comfort, and boredom regulating activities. To create a new life which NOW must MAINTAIN itself perpetually until...

But this is the naturalistic fallacy. Isnis not an ought. Unless you think we individual human organisms are morally bound to carry out nature's progr...

Sure it was. It was preparing for maintenance. It was enculturation, cultural preparation. I just don't believe the narratives given about the matteri...

But isn't this just de facto what we do, because the counterfactual of suicide is repugnant? Just because suicide is usually culturally/biologically n...

Let me ask it this way, why do you think it is permissible or right or a good idea to create a new being that must maintain its survival and regulate ...

Use your imagination. You can contemplate before-birth imaginatively, and death imaginatively. To simply ask why the in between matters as that is goi...

Life is not necessary, but it does indeed involve a lot of necessary chores. What is with this need for people to improve on things? Why expend energy...

Do I? I guess I believe giving people work to do is not right. Giving someone a constant chore of maintenance is not a gift. To put a new person in a ...

Yeah, I haven't given any robust arguments before... I prefer mine a bit pithier these days. I'm all ears if someone wants to expand though. As I've s...

I don't really get what you're saying. If I was to interpret, you are saying people don't have to work, but they should. I guess the presumption is wh...

I don't see how the repetitious maintaining of whatever systems, objects, processes, needs to happen. Novelty schmoevelty.. it's all the same- MAINTEN...

So why give people "stuff" to do. The "stuff" isn't so innocuous. Essentially a new person is created that must put forth the energy of maintaining th...

We are aware of the instrumental nature of surviving but for no reason. Putting in more energy, stress, all to maintain a human body and mind in order...

Instrumentality isn't necessarily about living for the future. It is simply the repetitious nature of surviving and keeping our mind's entertained bet...

It's more about posing the question than the result.

You get up, you do stuff to keep yourself alive, make sure your environs is more comfortable, find stuff to entertain yourself. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat...

Interesting points. To sleep that peaceful deep sleep is something that is not an option, though the hope is there in Eastern thought. Yes, the gummy-...

The meaning is related to the term. Instrumental in the fact that there is no finality. Survival, regulating comfort, and entertainments are simply in...

This makes sense to an extent. I still say it was better never to be put into the position of a system, of course, but if put in this position, certai...

Didn't really answer my question.. It's also not just a matter of "work" in the formal sense of going to work, but all the things necessary to maintai...

I'm not saying that. I'm saying, once the kid is born, they have been forced. The main word being "once". But, beyond this debate of non-identity, the...

By having the child, it is well-known that the child will eventually have to find a way to survive. Having the child, means knowing that the child wil...

I don't think so. It's pretty basic that by having a child, that child is going to have to find a way to maintain its survival in a social setting- ak...

By having people, how is that not forcing them to work de facto? I mean sure, they can always go against their instincts to live, especially when encu...

How is making others work good in and of itself other than appeal to some arbitrary divine command theory? It's only good in a hypothetical imperative...

I'm not sure causing other people to be born to have goals to fulfill is really good, especially in the light of the fact of contingent harms that wil...

But many times not.

Not really.

I just don't see it. Work for what? Sustaining oneself, to work, to sustain, to work, to sustain. We are tragically too self-aware for this scheme- an...

Correct

Yet we measly humans can choose to not perpetuate it, that is where the difference is between bacteria and the rest. How so? What is it they like so m...

Never

Interesting post, and seems to provide some good evidence of the unhappiness of romantic love. In tribal societies, perhaps this area is a bit less co...

All social relations related to friendship or romantic partners are about bargaining for loneliness. Humans are more-or-less social creatures, but wit...

Just trying to bring some Friday cheer to the conversation! ;) No good?

Perhaps all dating, sexual encounters, and intimate male/female relations in general are victimizing women in unfair power dynamics. Well, if it haste...

So you're saying through our destructive use of natural resources we will die out. Why would we just not intentionally choose to not add more absurd i...

Yes and that the more important questions we should be asking is why we put more people into the world in the first place. What to grow, maintain, and...

@"StreetlightX" Ecologies don't need a telos. That they exist, flourish and work as a system is a well known fact. Humans though have the ability to j...

Agreed, but that's my point. ALL humans from EVERY culture are here to perpetuate the culture, and are not here for themselves. That is an impossibili...

But my point was that it doesn't matter how complex the society is, institutions are there even in tribal societies. The point was the opposite rather...

@"Baden" @"Bitter Crank" @"Wosret" @"Metaphysician Undercover" Feel free to weigh in!

Until you address the institution of procreation, everything else is small peanuts ;) .

Well, it is definitely perplexing. Birth is very unusual as it is a preference that affects a whole other life, for a lifetime. Birth is actually a st...

Ah, carry on then. But, in a more specific context, what is it with the need to see people develop and have to interact with institutions, failing and...