Apollodorus

Supposing it was imposed. Presumably, it would be suggested by the authorities. Some may accept it and others may not accept it. In the latter case, i...

You could be right there. However, if you are talking about power, I think in every society there is a tendency to accumulate and monopolize power jus...

I think most countries have a "mainstream" accent that is understood across regional differences. Would a society be more equal and prosperous if grea...

Employers and the people you are dealing with. If you have an accent that nobody can understand, then this can give rise to communication problems. Th...

Nice neo-Marxist analysis. However, is there any evidence that British society is any more "unequal" than other societies like, say, India or some Afr...

If Plato is correct, then the axis is always there even though we may not be aware of it. Likewise, the ascent may be taking place without our conscio...

Awareness can be expanded in many different ways by becoming aware or paying attention to new areas of knowledge. But I think that being aware of awar...

Anyway, I have ZERO interest in Descartes, so if you want to start a thread on him, by all means do so.

I think your own exertions have been more than sufficiently productive and you've done a great job spreading it around, so there isn't much left for a...

I think I quite like the sound of "moonbats". It seems so have a certain resonance with "loony" (< Luna, Latin for "moon"), though I must admit "wingn...

And because there is zero evidence that it wasn't, presumably that means that it was. Great logic. On the other hand, the fact is that Aristotle was a...

Well, Athena, the goddess of the Athenian city-state, was certainly the goddess of wisdom, but she was also the goddess of heroes. Men are physically ...

If I'm not mistaken, they only submerge the head in a bowl of milk so it doesn't take a huge quantity for a new-born to drown. Unfortunately, I don't ...

:up:

I said "essentially": Of course there were some modifications or, rather, expansions of the Platonic teachings. But the original texts remained the sa...

From what I can see, you are claiming that Plato was an atheist and his writings teach atheism. You are also saying that Plato uses secret language to...

Correct. Like other Platonists, Plotinus did his best to fill whatever gaps he could by borrowing from Aristotle and others. But we must not forget th...

And that proves what exactly? Of course Platonists see Platonism as essentially one system. "Platonism", "Middle Platonism", "Neoplatonism", etc., are...

I'm sorry to have to say this but it sounds like you have some psychological issues there. You keep talking about "putting the pieces together", but y...

I agree. Incidentally, when I think of Plato or Platonism, I think Platonism and nothing else. I take Gerson's view (and that of Platonists themselves...

I think you're taking everything way too personally, and that is not a philosophical attitude. I don't want you to leave the forum, just to admit that...

That's exactly what we've been trying to explain to @Fooloso4. Unfortunately, he seems to think that we only do so because we are "intolerant" of his ...

That's what you are doing. You decide in advance that Socrates was an atheist and then try to twist the term "atheist" to make it fit Socrates. Or, yo...

I've already told you why. Because Plato's monistic idealism believes in the Universal Consciousness, Cosmic Intellect (Nous) or Mind of God, as the c...

You could be right. Maybe there is a tension there between individual struggle for survival and increased security with attendant chances of survival ...

Sadly, I think this once again shows how fanaticism prevents you from seeing your total lack of logic. What Plato writes in the dialogues is monistic ...

That's exactly what I'm saying. You can't say anything but are still talking. Not only that, but you are appealing to a mysterious "extensive literatu...

By the same token, you have demonstrated your inability to see what I and most people see, which is that Plato's writings teach a form of monistic ide...

Extensive or not, if Plato says nothing, then the literature on it can hardly be anything more than mere speculation ....

I never said Wiki is a scholarly source. I said it was mainstream. If you believe that Plato's alleged "atheism" is more then fringe speculation, feel...

Sorry, but that is totally untrue. My exact words were: Plato's teachings or what goes by the name of "Platonism" were referred to as "Plato's true te...

PS I didn't notice your comment below on the other thread: So what you are saying is this: 1. Plato never says anything. 2. The only thing that Socrat...

OK. So what you are saying is this: 1. Plato never says anything. 2. The only thing that Socrates says is that he knows nothing. If Plato says nothing...

I see. So, you are not talking about your arguments but about the arguments "in the dialogues". Great. In that case, allow me to ask again: In your op...

So, more diversion and evasion. As I said many times before I have absolutely nothing against your interpretation. I'm simply asking you to provide so...

What "argument"? I see nothing but persistent diversion and evasion: 1. You have "nothing to prove". 2. You have "no theory". 3. You are "following th...

:grin: You're talking about me getting "tired" but I think it's rather you who is getting tired and it's still early in the morning. You are beginning...

Here is your own statement. You have admittedly failed to prove your theory but still keep claiming that you have proved it. And that, without any evi...

I think the reverse is true. It is you who is not following the argument and is starting from the unexamined premise that Plato preaches atheism which...

There are many books and articles published every year on all kinds of topics. But they are not claiming or showing that Plato was an atheist. And it ...

Not at all, the esoteric is the ineffable Ultimate Reality. It isn't esoteric because it is secret but because it is inexpressible in language. I have...

He doesn't "banish the Gods" at all. He was discussing a hypothetical situation. You can't say "Plato secretly taught atheism" and at the same time cl...

Not at all, I demonstrated quite clearly, I think, that Plato's dialogues logically lead to monistic idealism which is the accepted scholarly position...

I disagree. A true zealot is always full of energy and inspiration and never tires. Anyway, why don't you tell us the truth? Why did you start this th...

Correct. Religious reform, not denial of the divine. That's why charges of "atheism" against Plato are not only inconsistent with the evidence but als...

No need whatsoever. As I suggested from the start, you had no chance of proving your case. You gave me a list of authors, which is fine. But I also su...

Yes, as Frank says, we were congratulating you for finally acknowledging that we are talking about Plato, not about Socrates, and that you have not pr...

I believe that it would have been difficult if not impossible to exclude Greek women from anything that was of importance in society. If you read the ...

And that "proves" he was an atheist? By what logical reasoning???

It is you who are attacking the long-established, evidence-based position that Plato is an idealist, and you claim that he was an atheist. I have no p...