Sir Philo Sophia

I'm just asking you for a clear definition of 'free will' and for you to compare/contrast that to the 'common definition' you apparently alluded to. I...

your odd definition of 'free will'. You brought up 'free will' in this thread and the OP's topic relates to "I propose that the brain only generates t...

you say a simple computer program is exercising 'free will', and you just said that your definition is not "common wisdom or a Common definition of fr...

Sure, what do you say is the 'common wisdom' meaning of "free will" and exactly where/how do you reason that is not accurate/true?

No, but those are not the only options. My current working hypothesis is that 'I' cannot be a program or process, but more of a state of matter/energy...

I disagree. We can experience many things that have meaning w/o the 'hard problem of qualia', like a shape of an object which has a very similar quali...

your original statement did not qualify it that way or indicate you were talking about 'common wisdom'. So, if you acknowledge that the 'common wisdom...

please give us an example of a stable deterministic program which is not constrained to a set of pre-determined behaviors and functions, yet achieves ...

this may be a fair point. However, only few creatures seem to exhibit self-consciousness , yet most all larger animals seem to have consciousness that...

Don't think that is true. It has been demonstrated that rats have counterfactual reasoning: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0960982...

so, sounds like you do not agree w/ @"Zelebg" that a robot operating 100% deterministic on its program is acting out 'free will' because it actions ar...

'free will' is not about only about anything that makes a choice. If it were then you can say the Earth is an agent and it has 'free will' to make wea...

is that a bad example? I mean, are you saying that breathing is an example of carrying out our 'free will'. That example actually makes my point, that...

are you saying that the standard definition/meaning of "free will" does not require an agent? do you believe the standard definition/meaning of "free ...

I think you are right that your question was non-trivial, but only b/c of your "b" part. This part I was saying was trivial: "a. we actually see color...

e.g., see this passage quoted below. Besides that, if panpsychism was true then would not you expect that the lowest forms of animals with brains coul...

Darwin's theories do not apply to #1 or #5. I already hinted at #2 in my above reply to you. See: re #3, certainly not. re #4, color and vision genes ...

wasn't Panpsychism thoroughly proven to not be viable by this author's publication below?: Bishop, J.M. (2009). A Cognitive Computation Fallacy? Cogni...

if better vision has more (e.g., energy) cost than its survival benefits then Darwin would say that better performing vision is even worse than worse ...

that is not an ontology between colors and electromagnetic radiation. You instead seem to be stating a utility. recall:

you got misdirected and hung up on me saying I 'created', which had nothing to do with my rhetorical point/example to Zelebg re the robot not having t...

sure, pretty clear our 'selves' is virtual entity (even panpsychist should agree with that); however, how do you logically tie that into "purpose of s...

I agree, but is that not implicit in how we use/mean the word 'will'? According to your definition, a crystal growing has 'free will' because it has "...

so, how can you have a 'will' w/o a sentient agent? Standard definitions seem to require the "I" be present in the agent. So, my robot example won't c...

sorry about that. My head is spinning with all the threads I'm conversing on, like a game of whach-a-mole. So, if you actually consider imagination to...

that is for another thread. I have been debating that with @"Possibility" on another thread, but we are currently stuck at "information". Once we clea...

I made it in a reply to @3017... which is along the lines of: I might add that, of course, all our mental representations of 'reality' operate this wa...

in a previous reply to discount me saying that we cannot imagine infinity you said that was b/c "Well as we are talking about what can be imagined, no...

So, you think 'imagination' is about math formulas and recursive algorithms (such as limits to infinity), and not about simulating the experience? I d...

Darwin would answer that Humans do not need to perceive color for the Aesthetics, but do for the optimal survival. It is well known that primates effe...

how would you say the colors we 'see' are ontologically "related to the reflectivity of electromagnetic radiation in the visible range"?

well put as to external, physical 'existence'. However, is it not so obvious that colors as we perceive cannot 'exist' in the mater itself? I mean, if...

This is just one type of info. This is not a complete definition of information. Moreover, nothing new about this idea. Seems to be just one type of i...

the color wheel is just a reflection of the existence of a collectively consistent human qualia/emotive experience of the colors. So, please clarify w...

I don't see how information is directly and necessarily related to any monotonic change in entropy. I see info as being more about the binding of data...

that is too supernatural for me. I'm finding a path towards qualia that is something that I can model and see a plausible utility/mechanics; that is, ...

:chin:

you are confounding so many things there it is incoherent. Introducing qualia adds needless further complexity and confounding. Pain alone, of course,...

not true. attention is paid in hopes of finding something meaningful worthy of the attention, often we pay and expand the scope of our attention try f...

now I see why you think all I said was incoherent, b/c you are off topic and missing the point of the thread. The thread is concerning only 'meaning' ...

why not? give me a concrete, detailed example, not abstract, circular, statements.

then you have to indicate which part of my clarification is not clear enough to you. I'm not going to play a guessing game on that after trying once.

logically that does not prove, or even evidence, that they are part of the same thing/process (e.g., forming knowledge). There can be multiple very pa...

not true. Datamining algorithms discover tremendous meaning out of otherwise meaningless data-sets/bases.

I already told you where/why I think you are wrong. "5. Program B: consciousness & free will -> feeds into 6.& 2" does not equal "a visual recognition...

I think Zelebg will explain it to us when he replies. stay tuned...

do you not appreciate the difference between pattern recognition (e.g., an AI neural network detecting the presence of a orange) and the abilities hum...

I think you are wrong about that. You certainly do not need sentience or consciousness to learn good enough "make choices". I assume you know better t...

upon what 'logic' do you conclude that? My model only requires the brain to do it. If panpsychism was true then would not you expect that the lowest f...

no. that is pattern recognition, which current AI robots routinely do.