Banno

https://www2.southeastern.edu/Academics/Faculty/jbell/conceptualscheme.pdf Read "model" for "conceptual scheme".

Ah, I see you have already done some critique. Excellent. Here you move towards my view; that there is no model. But I'll let you continue, at least f...

Nice post. A compelling presentation of language as a model of reality, the sort of thing that Wittgenstein set up in the Tractatus, only to rethink i...

Going around in circles isn't helping at all.

No. 1'. "The kettle is boiling" (1') is a sentence.

Sure. Quite agree.

But you said that was a sentence...

The tree we are talking about is outside of language? I don't understand that. Things such as the tree being, say, 11m tall, will be true regardless o...

Read it again.

Nuh.

Ah, that fact. The kettle is boiling. But you said that was a sentence... This bit: Is it both a sentence and a fact?

So, what is the fact to which your sentence "The kettle is boiling" points? In your own words. Take your time.

On the contrary, that is exactly what I am pointing to. Yes, that is what I have been at pains to point out.

I use the term as a loose collective for utterances, sentences, statements, truth bearers, truth bears and such. Ok, it's a proposition. So what does ...

Quoting myself. One issue here is what a "linguistic fact" is, so that we can understand what a "nonlinguistic fact" is. It seems to me that it doesn'...

Is it? So what is a proposition? Fill out your point.

(1) refers to the fact that the kettle is boiling. The kettle is boiling. (1) refers to that. (1) is about the fact that the kettle is boiling. The ke...

@"Bartricks" Nothing thing about me without me. Seems rude to talk behind his back.

It's as if someone were to argue like this... 5. ...... 4. "'"The kettle is boiling"'" 3. '"The kettle is boiling"' 2. "The kettle is boiling" ...and ...

No, (1) is "The kettle is boiling" and (2) is "La bouilloire est en ébullition". What do they say? I'll answer for you. They both say that the kettle ...

Yep. So, what do they say?

1. The kettle is boiling 2. "The kettle is boiling" 3. "'The kettle is boiling'" 4. ... One of these things is not like the others...

Exactly how? What sentence is (1)? Is (1) the sentence "the kettle is boiling" and (2) the sentence ""The kettle is boiling""? And these are different...

What sentence is it? Why, it's (2)... Hence (2) is the sentence... You seem to be brewing some sort of circularity.

You are aware that it is a dream and so definitely not reality, and that you can control the dream, which is not reality, and somehow you see that as ...

Yep. , you ought be able to recognise a rhetorical ploy when Lewis presents one. An argument designed to drive a wedge into its audience. Worthy of Tr...

Nor am I, nor are they with each other, and often nor are any of us even in agreement with ourselves...

@"fdrake", @"Sam26", @"creativesoul", @"Srap Tasmaner" 1. The kettle is boiling 2. "The kettle is boiling" 3. "The kettle is boiling" is true 4. '"The...

If every proposition is true, then truth is trivial. It does nothing.

Following on from the previous posts, if any proposition follows from a contradiction, then if the contradiction is true, any proposition is true; tha...

A talk by Gupta, on circular definition of truth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGc9SmIBL-4 Also https://www.jstor.org/stable/4545102?seq=1

A bit more... by way of fumbling my way through what I can find on this developing area. What follows is jumbled and incoherent, and hence is my notes...

That joke might serve as an example for the revision theory. Srap says everything Banno says is wrong. Banno says "I must be wrong". First revision: s...

And @"Sam26" supposed the Liar had little to do with ordinary language...

I quite like it, especially the way it defeats one's expectations on close inspection. It's not a moon, not a corridor, they are not people. If it win...

Well then, I must be wrong...

I'm slowly heading this thread towards a proof of consistency, then perhaps completeness. To that end, and because it seems at first odd, i'd like to ...

Generally, Srap, we seem to talk past each other. I'm not sure we are not saying the same thing, but arguing the expressions used.

Good. So logic is relevant to our discussion. I'm happy to leave this line there. Good night.

, It's well that you drew attention to this, since I missed it while out weeding. But I'm not sure what to say in reply; a form of life involves both ...

@"Sam26", The point, a small one, is that in the Tractatus Witti aims to set ordinary language aright by building a perfect language, then came to see...

So if it's @"fdrake"'s terminology, you are asking me to explain to you a terminology used by the fire dragon, and which I think does not work.

See PI§136.

I've no idea - that's your phrasing. Your asking me to explain your own terminology, a terminology I think doesn't work.

Well, from the PI §90's to §136 he does talk quite explicitly about logic, making one of the points you make - that the crystal clarity of logic is pu...

I choose not to talk about the stuff we can't talk about... You may do as you will.

I don't disagree, but it's just so poorly expressed... which I would put down to your trying to make use of the nonsense of "external reality". There'...

Sure, but there remains a difference between imprecision and contradiction. Again, if ordinary language gave out a contradiction, should we accept the...

So there are two questions remaining. Are truth sentences wrong? And if ordinary language were in disagreement with logic, with which would Wittgenste...

If I were to talk instead, perhaps for @"Sam26"'s sake, in terms of a form of life in which both kettles and "kettles" participate, the one making no ...