Good, so we need to consider context. But is your example literally possible? I noted this earlier in the thread, but it's worth repeating: If "someon...
Are you proposing this as context-free? Or does the object need to be presented in some way as to invite such a response? If so, what might be the con...
If a work is not emotionally moving it is absolutely not art. There is no exception. — I like sushi There has to be a line drawn somewhere, — I like s...
I can see it that way. "Pragmatic" can be understood in a variety of senses. This is really interesting to me. I'm going to try to write an OP that wi...
Yes, roughly. Is it appropriate for me to ask into some specifics? (You don't have to pursue this with me if it's a pain in the neck.) I'll take "curr...
Concerning purposes involving other people, I agree that most art doesn't have to be understood that way, though many artists value communication as a...
So do you have a story, or explanation, for what happened to (so-called, in your view) art in the 20th century? Why were the lines not drawn where you...
I would likely have the same reaction, if I saw this work. But are you open to the idea that emotional response is not criteriological? That objects a...
That sounds to me like a new type of art! But I know what you mean. Interestingly, Danto talked a lot in his later writings about art within a particu...
Yes, this is insightful on Duchamp's part. As you say, this sounds like a good expansion of the "artworld" idea. There's room to include the artist th...
This is a great exposition of how and why Fountain was first seen as non-art. Watching how the conversation has evolved on this thread, I want to add ...
Good point. What should we say, then? You go on to note Perhaps that's good enough; the distinction isn't clear, usage-wise, and it's no wonder people...
Is it still art if no one sees it that way (except the creator)? Should we say, "intentionally attempts to create art"? Also, the verb "create" is ver...
Thanks for responding. I'm having great difficulty following your thoughts, however. Could you perhaps just begin by saying what you think Williams' p...
Yes, this is right. I was implicitly importing my idea of which "artworld" would be appropriate in a discussion about a possibly-museum-worthy paintin...
If either of these things happened just as described, it would be vandalism, not art, and the person would presumably be arrested. :smile: Seriously, ...
The letter you quote from makes an excellent case for why computer programs are not agents in anything like the sense a human is. Do you agree that we...
Do you mean, they would not be from our point of view, or from the point of view of an Absolute Conception that claims to be able to give an explanati...
Really interesting and helpful, thanks. Couple of thoughts: I agree with you, as it happens, about personhood here, but we have to recognize that many...
But as we've been discussing, we don't need an absolute scale in order to compare good and better. I'm saying that a literal interpretation of, e.g., ...
And that what we started with is the key to such an interpretation. I know you're doubtful whether there could be a useful interpretation of holy book...
This is a great question, IMO. I'll go out on a limb and say that nothing very interesting can be said about aesthetics without locating what you're s...
Yes, because here we have a question about the actual composition of the object, which Danto showed was not the question concerning art tout court. I ...
Yes, that needs to remain clear. You read a poem; you derive a meaning; it may or may not be what the poet intended, though it's often reasonable to i...
Ah, but then you don't actually "see the cat on the mat" . . . my avatar is a digital entity, to put it generously. Which doesn't mean you haven't ass...
My 2 cents -- and @"Hanover" may see it differently -- is that by putting it this way, we're succumbing to the illusion that "an LLM" could have any s...
Good. Just out of curiosity, has it been shown that an AI program can pass the Turing Test? The examples of bot-talk that I've seen cited in TPF would...
At one point, that was accurate. But the technology rapidly advanced so that what is now presented in a photograph is as open to question as what a pa...
I see your point. It's a tough nut. Do we need to try to find some limit cases where we could speak of a programmer "intentionally" doing something vi...
Yes, this is all fine, though "black box" might be overemphasizing the inscrutability. That's why the Chatbot example seems relevant. We do not have t...
Nor does it imply that there aren't cases where speaker intent is very important. I think the Chatbot example is such a case. The program itself can't...
More defensible is, "If we say it is art, then it is art," which can also open up interesting conversations about who is included in "we." "What art i...
We're all saying the same thing here. So the interesting question is, What are those stories? What are those circumstances? How do they vary from era ...
I'm going to say Yes, but the next question is, "What makes a painting art?" As you say, why isn't a "painting" that covers my walls with white paint,...
Again, your responses are thoughtful, on point, and help develop the questions of the OP. Much appreciated. Right. And we have to hold out against tho...
This is good. I think we forget, because the phrase is now part of the atmosphere, that "The View from Nowhere" was undoubtedly intended to sound absu...
:party: At the risk of jeopardizing our accord, I do need to clarify that I'm using "analysis" to mean something like conceptual analysis and its logi...
Nah, just had to return to real life for a while. But I wanted to be sure to acknowledge my mistake first. Precision is a focus here, for sure. But no...
I think the Williamson essay is itself a good example, though I suppose some would dispute its rigor. Or for a broader example, Thomas Nagel's work is...
Out of curiosity, what do you take Williams' position to be on the question of the Absolute Conception? Could you set it out in Williams' terms, rathe...
Of course you were. This is the dark, problematic side of scientism. I don't know how we'd settle the question of whose "intuitiveness" we're talking ...
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