Boris Johnson (All General Boris Conversations Here)
Well... Here we go again. Another raving bloody loony in an office they have no business being in. I give him less than a year. That office is cursed now, just like the Defense against the Dark Arts teaching post at Hogwarts.
So lets get the ball rolling. With Boris in charge, what do we think will happen to the UK?
It should also be made aware that I am Scottish and while I will do the best to view this PM with the same impartiality that I normally would with those in other countries, I expect some of what I will say will in the end to be marginally biased to some degree.
So lets get the ball rolling. With Boris in charge, what do we think will happen to the UK?
It should also be made aware that I am Scottish and while I will do the best to view this PM with the same impartiality that I normally would with those in other countries, I expect some of what I will say will in the end to be marginally biased to some degree.
Comments (133)
Perhaps it's only eclipsed by the bromance between Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn and President Bernard Sanders. :razz:
Exactly.
As a true Scotsman, what do you think are the chances of Scotland severing it's union with England?
Boris will immediately shift to the left, if not in rhetoric, in practice. And he'll blame moderates for thwarting him when he fails to do what he has no intention of doing, i.e. delivering Brexit by October 31, which will give him cover against the Brexit Party for the next general election. So, interesting set-up. The good news is the last thing he really wants is a no-deal Brexit because that's all that stands in the way of his utopian lies about the economics of which being exposed as such. Added to that, kept alive as an ideal, it can remain the totem under which he continues to lullaby his Daily-Mail-chewing base to sleep. In other words, he's said exactly what you would expect a self-serving arsehole to say to win over the Conservative activists necessary to beat Hunt to the PMship. And now he will do exactly what you would expect a self-serving arsehole to do to keep himself in the PMship for as long as possible, which does not include delivering the unattainable Brexit dream but extending the false quest for it to legendary proportions.
If only.
Apparently the first thing he said as Prime Minister was "Good morning". In the afternoon.
I donât feel Jeremy Corbyn is the man for the job of PM. While I think heâd be better served writing legislation I think heâs been in the negative spotlight of the BBC for too long to have a realistic hope of winning a majority for labour.
If Scotland do leave the union, it may have a domino effect and we may see an independent wales, a unified Ireland and there are even some regions of England that may break off too, Cornwall particularly.
The polls among the English indicate that they care more about Brexit being carried out than they do about maintaining the union and I donât think labour can win against the tide of ignorance surrounding the Brexit issue right now. Iâm open to a compelling argument that might be more optimistic toward the possibility the union is maintained. Unless Brexit is derailed though, I think it will be the end of the United Kingdom. The hurdles and benefits for Scotland in such a case are many of both.
I don't predict a no-deal scenario under Johnson, as surely that would be political suicide, as, it seems to me, would a delay or an extension to negotiations past his own 'do or die' deadline of 31st October. So it seems he's stuck between a rock and a hard place, and now simply must get a deal through parliament. Although maybe @Baden is right, and we could end up in a scenario where parliament blocks a no-deal and Johnson can then blame them for it.
Can he really solve the Backstop issue in time? Can he get a deal through parliament in time? I guess we'll see. I also can't see him lasting long. And I hope I'm right. He's for tax cuts for the rich, he has a record of gross incompetence, he has made comments suggestive of racism, sexism, homophobia, and islamophobia, he has a bad character, he deliberately evades giving straight and honest answers to questions, he's shallow and out for himself...
Get over it.
I would say there is no "solving" the backstop issue. There is only capitulation from the UK or more pretending. For 'backstop', read 'The Good Friday Agreement'. That ain't being given up.
Right. Well, many of us truthfully said the same thing about one Donald Trump, and it seems quite possible that he could get re-elected. No one every went broke underestimating the intelligence of the electorate. If you can fool enough of the people enough of the time, you can get elected and re-elected.
Now do you have something important to say that isn't immature?
Hi, I'm Michael. Most of what I say is useless and lacks substance. But I like to think that I'm occasionally witty.
Boris mentioned "alternative arrangements" to the backstop. Do you think that that's a pretence then? I have to say, I'm sceptical of these "alternative arrangements".
Yeah, he has a similar appeal as that of Trump to a certain group. I realise that. But I'm thinking more about the practicalities of what he has to get through in order to stay in power. It's not comparable to Trump's situation. Boris has to deliver on Brexit, and all of his strongly worded rhetoric, whilst at the same time, if he actually took us out without a deal, as he has threatened, or if that seemed imminent, then I predict that the opposition would be so strong as to spell his downfall. So he has no easy task ahead. Remember, Brexit has already been the downfall of two previous Prime Ministers: David Cameron and Theresa May.
Notice woolly phrasing of exactly zero substance. Try searching for the 'alternative arrangements' he's referencing and you'll find nought that hasn't been outright rejected by the EU and Ireland. There's more likelihood of Norwich City winning the league next season than of the backstop being dropped. (A joke in there about canaries and coal mines which I can't be bothered extracting. :D )
Tbh, I think Trump actually believes a lot of the stupid shit he comes out with whereas Johnson is purely a mop-topped heat-seeking missile for power. There is literally nothing else to him but machination.
Swinson might surprise you. She's got just the pizzazz the Lib Dems need and at just the right time. They won't win it, but they'll complicate matters and that's a huge improvement on being irrelevant.
:grimace:
They can keep Chuka.
Yeah, not a fan either.
:lol: But :cry:
A bomb? Yes, in so many ways; a heat-seeking missile... Donald and Boris are both too much the lard ass to soar. They roll and crush.
In America, each new bad president makes the last bad president look better in retrospect. Do you think Boris will improve May or Cameron?
Perhaps. If his election prompts a suicide pact between them.
... j/k. To your question, yeah, bring back MayBot and/or greasy PR guru, big Dave. We miss your moderately less grevious sins against humanity.
How about John Major.
Sheâs got dyed blonde hair and pouty lips, and a steely blue stare, like a sadistic nurse in a mental hospital.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/11/boris-johnson-sings-hillary-clinton-praises
Works for me!
Pity his name is not Bloris Jobson!
Seriously though, I see at least two possible (even if not likely to be achieved) options: get Parliament to vote yes, or get the EU to re-negotiate. Can he deliver? Someone (whatever we might feel about him or her) has to deliver something, so GO BO JO!
Yeah, I agree it would seem unlikely that the EU will capitulate. How much more likely do you think the Parliament is to agree to "Brexit without a deal"? Are we in a position to assess those likelihoods? Will Bo Jo work his Mojo? If not, then what?
1. Start drinking
2. Don't stop
Spot the difference:
But that's exactly what you'd expect the EU to say, whether that's a true reflection of their endgame or not. And parliament won't vote through an unchanged deal. And a no deal scenario would be vigorously opposed. So, I reckon it's either a renegotiated deal or a crisis that would trigger a vote of no confidence.
Bojo doesnât run the country, May didnât run the country and practically every single PM prior to them all - as far as I can think - didnât run the country either.
The issue is in The House and how the differing parties and representatives work with and against each other within the limitation of what the major players in the banks, educational system and âmilitaryâ allow. The House of Lords is the problem. Once it collapses - and more people are pushing for this than ever before - then the whole system will come down on top of it.
PMâs and Presidents and minnows. Bojo is no fool. Maybe heâs no good but heâs CERTAINLY no fool and CERTAINLY nowhere near as incompetent as people make him out to be.
A mess needs to be made. I hope he makes a GOOD mess if things, but I wonât hold my breath because I donât imagine the idea of ânationâ will survive this century ... but weâll have to wait for another 30-50 years to see that hatchling come out. By 2100, or maybe a few decades before, all these recent occurrences will be seen as the signs of a political global revolution.
Thatâs how I see it anyhoos! :)
Thatâs all we really know about the man behind the clown mask: Itâs a person with no convictions, delivering a political project he does not believe in, with a plan that does not exist.
Itâs proper, next-level postmodern politics. There are numerous layers of understanding, and it does, indeed, seem âterribly clever.â But once you get past the knowing winks, thereâs nothing there at all.[/quote]
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2019/07/24/boris-johnson-plays-clown-hes-really-just-power-hungry-nihilist/?utm_term=.3aa71ee335c9
:100:
Quoting Maw
I do. And I will watch this later. The debate is mentioned here in an excellent article. Heading:
The prime minister has a bust of his Greek hero in No 10. But Johnson is no Pericles
He is more like Alcibiades, the vain playboy with unpredictable loyalties who briefly succeeded the Athenian leader.
Quoting Simon Jenkins
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jul/27/boris-johnson-no-10-pericles-greek-hero
Really ? You don't think they would make a devilish pact with the Tories again ?
Ah sorry - this was about being an anti-Brexit Conservative.
You're right.
:up:
Channel 4 news, interviewers and interviews.The best.
Even the weather forecast :cool:
Edit to add: I note we can subscribe to this.
https://www.channel4.com/news/no-deal-extension-election-boris-johnsons-brexit-plan-politics-where-next-podcast
Quoting Gary Gibbon
:up: In a nutshell.
That's not true. He's a democratic socialist, and he has pledged to nationalise the railways and end the energy consumer rip off. He has said nothing about nationalising the banks, and you won't hear the sort of Marxist rhetoric you'd find from the Communist Party of Great Britain from the mouth of Jeremy Corbyn. The Labour party is not a Marxist party, Militant members were expelled, and they removed clause four many years ago.
Quoting Michael
They don't stand a chance of getting into government, so it'd be a wasted vote.
Iâll have you know theyâll win 650 seats at the next election.
But here's a certified true picture of Karl Marx on his way to a meeting with Jeremy Corbyn to convince the Labour leader to destroy Britain's economy and personally consume every bank he can stick a pitchfork in. (Modern surgical techniques have enabled Karl to have his horns removed, but don't be fooled, it's him!)
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jul/28/dude-i-take-no-pleasure-in-having-been-right-about-boris-johnson-stewart-lee
https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/03/uk/boris-johnson-end-of-the-union-analysis-intl-gbr/index.html
What's interesting about Boris is how apparently hard it is for him to even pretend he gives a shit about anything. He delivers every policy line as if he's about to burst out in derisive laughter at the end of it. He's a conscious self-reflexive parody of himself. This goes beyond Trump who at least usually has the decency to look like he's actually crazy, andâcruciallyâenough so to believe his hardcore supporters aren't. What's perpetually scribbled across Boris's mop-topped mug, on the other hand, is an unconcealed impish amusement at the level of idiocy of those who catapulted him to the position of PM (with the deliciously ironic supplementary self-designation of "Minister of the Union" hammering home their folly). To say he's a buffoon is almost to miss the mark. He's a buffoon bathing in the confident assurance that the buffoonery of the system, the media, and the plebs that prop up his ridiculous, bloated frame infinitely out-buffoons him.
The way he will(apparently) do it is by beating Corbyn decisively in an election and delivering Brexit, hence rendering the Brexit party meaningless. There's no other way of saving them and Johnson has the popularity amongst the electorate ( supposedly) to do it.
The're doomed in the long run, as their support is mainly old middle class white and almost non existent in the young, and what there is is dropping off a cliff at the moment.
I would point out that the way Corbyn is depicted in the British media Including on the BBC is over critical and biased in favour of an accepted view amongst the intelligentsia/establishment that he is bad news, an extreme socialist, Marxist( in the most negative sense)* and that his government would pretty much bankrupt the country, drown us in debt, be chaotic and disorganised and bring back overbearing unions etc etc. Such views, although often watered down, are widely accepted as fact in the UK amongst large swathes of the population. This bias has persisted from the 1970's and is rarely challenged in the media and many left wing commentators are largely disregarded as lefties.
In reality it would begin to bring back some sorely needed balance in the running of the country, which has become unequal, exploitative etc, with public services in a state of bankruptcy. It left us over exposed in the financial crisis, with most of the population just about managing, teetering on the edge of defaulting on their mortgages, or loans( so you can see how sorely we need a no deal Brexit).
*I didn't even mention the slurs about a Corbyn foreign policy. Which are in the realms of he is dangerous( wear as Johnson is not), is probably in the pocket of Putin and could not be trusted to push the nuclear button if the country was under attack.
I expect you are aware of how inflated property prices discriminate against the under resourced. In the UK the housing crisis is fuelling a rapid increase in the gap between the rich and the poor. Leaving anyone who is not a property owner exploited by those who do and the redistribution of the poor into sink towns and estates and the well off gentrifying idillic villages and desirable areas. These forces are exploited through contemporary forms of capitalism and corporate interests. This alongside the way in which the wealthy and corporations syphon of wealth and profits offshore, is bleeding the society dry.
We really do need this state of affairs rectifying , rather than being fuelled by a trade deal with the US.
"[BoJo is] bluffing both sides of the Brexit divide at home in an attempt to consolidate the Leave vote and provoke his opponents into saving him from the near-certain catastrophe of a no-deal Brexit, which would threaten to destroy the Toriesâ reputation for economic competence for a generation. Leaving the EU was never Johnsonâs priority: It was seizing power. And now that heâs moved into Downing Street, Johnson will do everything he can to stay there."
Yes, in short, the Overton window is in dire need of a leftward shift. Perhaps now more than ever.
They have quite a few similarities. Although, whereas Gove metaphorically knifed Boris in the back, Castlereagh literally shot Canning.
Corbyn asked repeatedly for him to publish the revised operation yellow hammer report which was to be published today by Gove, but which was pulled due to being too alarming for the public. He didn't answer and waffled on like some drunken outdated bar prop.
Tbh, it's an important question whether he believes a lot (or any) of the stupid shit he says, but a commentator today on NPR noted that while presidential candidates have all backed off of statements that fact-checkers found to be erroneous, Donald Trump doesn't back off -- he repeats the information that had been found false (or misleading) and amplifies it. His "base", who think he is persecuted by the press, hear the press identifying un-truths, lies, make believe, etc. coming from the WH, and they think to themselves, "No matter what Trump says, the press accuses him of lying, or being wrong..."
Fascism has been characterized as "more of a method than a message". Fascism destroys the basis of cogent discussion of real issues by deeply obfuscating policy, lying, issuing misleading information, and in general presenting a chaotic front.
I have not yet arrived at the conclusion that Donald Trump is a fascist, but there is an odor of fascismo about him that is unsavory; it has top notes of cadaverine. Proposals to eliminate ALL refugee admissions to the U.S. (refugees -- not talking about illegal immigrants here) is a the sort of hateful move I would expect from someone with fascistic tendencies. Ditto his reversals of progressive environmental policies aimed at reducing CO2 emissions. Ditto ad nauseum.
It's looking as though Boris is spent, there are more Tory MPs considering their positions this weekend. Due to actions like prorogation and removing the whip from Tory MPs. As I see it if Johnson tries to pull a fast one now, then he will loose support from another group of MPs and will be so weakened that it will clear the way for a no confidence vote and an alternative government being formed. All my worries about him breaking the law or sculduggery are evaporating.
https://twitter.com/IamHappyToast/status/1171050051860422657?s=20
Or maybe he is very cunning, he will claim ownership of the bridge and charge a toll.
Maybe the bridge will be a prelude to a new Celtic Union of National Territories, whose acronym shall be a fond remembrance of the British Prime Minister who inspired its inception.
The Tories, in contrast, are only now pledging to increase their National Living Wage (not the Minimum Wage!) to ÂŁ10.50 per hour, but not until 2024, and even then, it will still exclude anyone under the age of 21. (It currently excludes anyone under the age of 25!).
And yet the current Tory Chancellor, Sajid Javid, has the nerve to declare at the Tory party conference, "It's clear it's the Conservatives who are the real party of labour - we are the workers' party".
No, you're not.
I can't imagine who would believe the pledges of the Tory party now, they have no credibility left. It will go down as the worst Tory conference in history I think, they really have lost the plot.
Both are sooo united these days.
Worse than Theresa's? :snicker:
It seems to me that they manufactured rather more convincing Prime Ministers back then. I rather suspect that Johnson is a rather late example of the sixties satire boom!
https://twitter.com/BestForBritain/status/1529462147985588225?s=20&t=kw1TbxkbuUN8NXy8Ejk_GA
https://thegrayzone.com/2022/05/15/operation-leaked-emails-intelligence-coup-boris-johnson/?fbclid=IwAR0AxHvhLxxd1ctbnuG3UMXCKv8mcSQPpp7KqT-jmYPMO0vBolXbcek4fy0
Oh! :naughty: My conscience is expressing its true feelings again.
It isn't a good thing, and it has been going on for a long time. When one cannot believe anything the government says, one literally has no government, and that has been the situation for 2 years. The pretence of government continues for another month or two...
'He looks a bit like you. Do you ever get taken for him?'
He told me that he often does and it seemed that at times he finds it rather difficult. But, he is slimmer and less a look alike than one who looks like Ed Sheeran.
The man discussed the mess of British politics and during the conversation I remembered that it is voting day, because it is a local election in London today. However, I am telling myself that I should go and vote but feel tempted not to do so because the various leaders don't see to represent much hope for change in any positive sense.
'Twas brexit and the tory coves
Did may and leadsome in the waab
All rees-mogg were the michael goves
And the dominics out-raab.
.
"He's resigned but he hasn't fucked-off?"
:rofl: What a brilliant and accurate rant! An excellent clip. I like this guy, I hope he's a socialist.
Voting is more like harm minimization these days. At least try to keep the least bad motherfuckers from getting in. Hopelessness and catastrophizing only rewards the fascists.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/love-him-or-loathe-him-boris-johnson-was-britain-s-most-consequential-pm-since-thatcher-20220707-p5b00f.html
:mask: :up:
Bojo was aware that Chrisp Incher had groped two men while "incredibly drunk" and didn't do anything about it. Seems sort of reasonable. Can anyone be so drunk that their inebriation is not creditable? As for groping--rude, maybe. Depends on the gropee. Did they file criminal charges? When women are 'incredibly drunk' and end up in compromising situations, we generally excuse the woman. Why not Pincher?
That said, may all tories rot in hell--gay, straight. groped, or grappled.
That SMH OP I posted makes some important points - Johnson was elected in a massive landslide and was hugely popular, especially among a lot of traditionally Labor seats. Obviously he's a pathological liar and fails the test of character, but I think those facts about him also need to be acknowledged.
Not really. He has split the GOP, and now I think I saw a poll indicating at least 50% of them are more or less anti-Trump. But it's a sad state of affairs.
Well, that's a bit of good news despite the sadness around it.
But 50% still means Trump can hold on. Boris was struggling to get 5%
â Britain's Conservatives just did what America's Republicans never dared to do.â
https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/07/politics/donald-trump-boris-johnson-analysis/index.html
I second that emotion and I will also back up one of the issues you raised. In my younger days, almost every time I wore a kilt to an event some woman or group of women would come up from behind and lift up the back of my kilt to see if I was a 'true Scot.' Double standards or what?
My own admission must also be that I did not mind at all if I thought the woman doing the lifting was attractive! Still, it's sooooooo true that I would be simply arrested and charged with sexual assault If I lifted up the back of women's skirts to see if they were wearing any underwear!!!!!
I do genuinely think authority is scared of 'people power' or even 'the mob' in the UK.
Even a rich and powerful individual can be destroyed in the public domain.
I know the 'big picture' of social forces in the UK are very complicated and often contain a great deal of 'vested interest' and sometime a force of change can contain the strangest of bedfellows. Crazy combinations such as atheists and theists working in common cause against a vile political policy such as sending asylum seekers to Rwanda. Sometimes the nefarious trip over each other so much that they all become vulnerable to an ever watching free press (or at least the few good honest reporters which do exist) and the wonderful antinefarious weapon that is the 'whistleblower.'
âThe sinking ship is leaving the rat.â - UK Labour Opposition Leader Keir Starmer on the conservative mutiny.
Your complete guide to the chimera of UK democracy: https://www.doubledown.news/watch/2022/july/11/peter-oborne-demolishes-boris-johnsons-legacy
[quote=Daniel Bonevac]Meet the new boss, same as the old boss![/quote]
:snicker:
He's still incredibly decent compared to Trump.
A yank's rose-tinted perspective...
But he didn't incite a riot at Parliament, suggesting that the rioters should execute the vice-Prime-minister. Is there a vice-Prime-Minister?
There was, but they've been executed already.
:grimace:
But don't take my word for it, listen to his colleagues:
Privileges committee.
SMH
Talk about being hoist by one's own petard. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: