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The Fifth Stage by Christoffer

Noble Dust January 01, 2024 at 02:30 425 views 24 comments
My weary eyes, my wandering mind. My temple losing its hold on reality, falling through the cracks of existence; a fight I will soon lose, surrendering to sleep.

In my specific vocation, you encounter a substantial number of curiosities: the victims and the malevolent, the fools and the fool-hearted. Navigating their realities, judging their behavior, their motivations, sifting through statistics and data—lives. Drawing judgements on a moment’s glance, or the nature of an out-of-place remark. People hold contempt for the likes of me, and I don’t blame them. After twenty-something years of this path, I believe myself to have gathered somewhat of a conscience. Or at least a reason for this infernal insomnia.

The irony then; to find myself in the serenity of these late hours. Why? Why this sense of tranquility after acquiring a knowledge that would grind all of civilization into dust?

Let me recollect.

-

A wave of déjà vu flowed through me as I presented my credentials as an insurance investigator to the tired receptionist at the mental hospital. By robotic routine she prepared my plastic identity tag as I recalled her presence from another case: A proper fool, newly admitted after his home caught fire. Police found him in less than his underpants, expressively wandering a nearby forest. Undoubtedly my most rapid solve time to date. Definitely arson; definitely involved, but the question of active fraud lingered. As the interview started; sequentially did his performance; throbbing eyes and hearing voices. I interrupted and expressed a simple truth. That this particular ward had not discharged a single patient in decades. He was given two options; either live with sanity in prison or remain to perform insanity for even longer. Facing the reality of spending life amidst real lunacy, he broke down once more and the case was closed, followed by personal notoriety from the local law enforcement.??

”I can prescribe something for that.” The doctor suggested as my microsleep faded away. We traversed down the corridors with locked patient doors. Tiny windows hinted fragments of broken individuals as I pondered about the experience of a disintegrating reality to such serious degree. It stirred me nauseous. ??

”The initial report mentioned him in a catatonic state. Car collided with a parking pole near the beach, and police found him gazing at the rising sun, unable to communicate.” The doctor explained as we arrived at a specific door.??

”I’ve concluded a severe mental breakdown and acute depression. He showed signs of extreme paranoia, which is why he ended up here for observation.” The doctor continued as I peered through the limited view through the small window. It revealed a curled-up man in the corner of his bed, dressed in unremarkable all light blue.??

”Any danger?” I queried.??

”No spontaneous violence, only occasional mild anger, nothing out of the ordinary.” He replied.?

”Any, you know, suicidal stuff?” I inquired, provoking an odd smile. ??

”On the contrary. For the diagnosis I’m leaning against, there should be notable signs of it, but it seems every time we try to calm him down with any substances, he gets violently defensive, blaming us for repeatedly killing him” ??

”Repeatedly?” I asked. The doctor ignored further explanations and nodded a ’go-ahead’ to a nearby nurse who approached the door. ??

”He can talk?” I pressed.??

”Quite so.”



”I want you to investigate an oddity.” My boss stressed over the phone. It was still early and dark as I kissed my sleeping son goodbye. ??

I drove, indulging an extra-strong coffee, wiping the condensation off the cold car windows revealing morning dew glistening over the empty city streets.

Arriving, the remnants of the facility still smoldered, casting god rays in the morning sun. Firemen gathered equipment, rolling up fire hoses. The police captain and fire chief conversed as I approached. Familiar faces from old cases, Roland and Parker.??

”Here we go again, oddballer.” Roland greeted with a smile, holding out his hand and I greeted them both.

”Yeah, it’s clear arson, and a sloppy one indeed. Still searching for the guy.” Parker added.??

”You see these tracks, and the residue?” He pointed at the ground, and an open petrol can. ??

”I’m guessing someone accidentally doused the place, then accidentally tossed a cigarette on it?” I replied. ??

”What would we do without your amazing deduction skills?” Parker exaggerated with a laugh. ??

”Anything else?” I inquired and Roland described the scene with his wild gestures:??

”Pretty cut and dry, our guy botched his parking, went inside and torched the place. Would have needed access codes and ID card considering the fire started deep in the labs with all the equipment and documents gathered in a large pile. We’re about 109 percent sure who did it.” I took in the scenery. Most of the building still stood firm, a dark slice where the roof had been, its surviving windows oozing a dark residue.??

”What is this place?” I asked as they too gazed up.??

”Some laboratory, neuroscience kind of stuff,” Parker informed while Roland made an exit for his car:??

”I’ve lined up some employees and emailed the profile. Let me know if you get anything else out of this mess.” ??

They knew I would solve it for them.



The rest of the world stirred as I took a bite out of my ham-cheese sandwich at a nearby coffee-shop. People slowed to a halt in front of the mess for their customary social media rituals before moving on. The swirling aroma from the busy kitchen filled the air with a hunger-inducing texture, if it hadn’t been for the stench of grilled plastic wafting through the entrance door. I texted my son to remember locking the door before school and turned my attention to the iPad glowing the perps profile. ??

He was a smart one; Paul, the owner. Wrote a paper on quantum mechanics, some collapsing functions beyond my realm of understanding. Moved into neuroscience and sleep research, later bought the place 15 years ago with the help of private investors. All paid back by his treatment contributions to big pharma. He showed no prior mental health issues, no problems of any kind, not even a hint at some immoral love triangle with interns, nothing. If he had grasped for wealth he would merely have needed to sell and be content, but rather he let himself be consumed by work, by his life passion. Odd indeed. I needed more backstory.??


?
I entered the apartment of one of Paul’s lab assistants. She gathered away some kid toys as I shed my coat, waiting patiently amid the fragrance of last nights sleep. ??

”Sorry, this morning. But I already talked to one of your colleagues?” She said and I showed my ID, prompting the all familiar ”you people” reaction. ??

”What do you want?” She uttered as we settled in the kitchen. I pulled out my iPad to show the documents. ??

”Why do you think he did it?” I queried.??

”I really don’t want to screw him over, okay?” She hesitated with a nervous head-scratch. I softened my tone.??

”I’m afraid he’s pretty much screwed already. I just want to understand why, and in this situation, it would probably even help him, help all of you.” It was a well-rehearsed line, a useful tool in my bag.??

”I dunno, he was fine until a couple of months ago. We all worked on neurological sleep patterns, trying to find irregularities and outliers in the data. Then he started to spend more and more time on it than everyone else. Trouble sleeping…” She paused abruptly. I let her breathe.??

”He’s the lead researcher, he didn’t have to do all the grunt work himself, that was our responsibility. But he kept locking us out. Then… he snapped one day. Found him having a panic attack in his office, serious one. We didn’t make anything out of it with our review and all coming up, and then all of this happens.” She shook her head.? ?

”Any copies of the research?” I probed, already sensing the obvious.??

”No, everything was in there, and I checked our network backup from here and, no it’s all gone. I can’t even tell you anything really, he knew the entirety of it. He even cut out his old research partner which I thought was strange; they always published together.”??

”Some animosity between them?” I inquired.??

”No, not at all, Paul just kept isolating himself and his research. I think it was that kid,” She said noticeably struggling to recall his name. ??

”What kid?” I pressed.??

”A patient of ours, he had some neurological issues we gathered data on. I think that broke him for some reason.”??

-

The nurse unlocked the door to Paul’s room. ??

”He’s not gonna do anything.” The doctor assured me while keeping a safe distance himself. I carefully moved into the room as the door shut behind me with an echoing slam.

The room was sparse; a bed and a table with two chairs made out of light wood. Above the bed a window; although secured with tempered glass, I hoped. In the corner by the door, a discarded bible. I sat down, observing Paul still curled up on his bed.??

”It’s a double-sick joke.” He mused. ??

”What is?” I inquired. He turned to the Bible. ??

”Thinking that would help me while mocking my profession.” He muttered. ??

”I don’t think that was the intention.” I said placing freshly printed documentation on the table. ??

”No, they just think its part of the cure.” He continued muttering.? ?

”For what?” I fired back.?

”The fear of death!” he shouted towards the door as if to shoo away some lingering staff. He stood up to view the documents.??

”I’m from your insurance company and…” I tried before he interrupted. ??

”Fuck you! Why are you really here?” His aggression startled me as I found myself lacking an honest answer. Case was already somewhat done.??

”Actually… I don’t know.” I replied. He laughed.??

”You really don’t, do you?” He remarked, settling down on the chair. ??

”Well, lay it out then, what do you need of me?” He pushed as I tried to regain my composure. My wandering eyes noticed the details of the wall. At first I had thought them part of some intricate wallpaper, but in that moment realized the work was his. Thousands of small lines for which the first few thousands had been crossed out. Paul noticed my observation.? ?

”That’s just my estimated number of deaths so far, and the rest.” He remarked and pointed casually.??

”Because the staff here kills you?” I inquired with a tad of mockery.??

”Exactly! Stupid fucks wouldn’t understand it even if I did a lecture on it.” He muttered.??

”Try me then” I provoked and he tilted his head, judging my intellect. ??

”What’s your level of knowledge in neuroscience? In quantum mechanics?” He mocked back.??

”Not even a little” I replied, feeling a returning aura of authority. He laughed and I interrupted him:?

”But I do like to know more about the kid.” My inquiry seemed to rattle something within him. His hand reached out and grabbed a photo of the burnt-out interior. His demeanor fading into something broken. ??

”You sure you want to know?” He warned me as my eyes wandered over the scratch pattern on the wall.??


?
A couple of months prior, Paul and his colleagues made an enigmatic discovery: Through the hundreds of thousands of neurological measurements spilled out on long graphs, the exploration began with a small red circle, drawn with a sharpie around a curious anomaly, accompanied by a sloppy handwritten remark: ”Odd”. Additionally, with some other pen, another note; a nod to old-time explorations as some kind of warning: ”Here be dragons”. No one knew from who. Paul fixated on this little oddity and spent all his time attempting to replicate. ??

As sleep sets in we venture through four stages of being, each one drifting our mind and body deeper down until our dreams reveal themselves. The dragon Paul had discovered, lured down there in our deepest existence. It quickly drove Paul and his team to prematurely open their celebratory Champagne as they hypothesized the existence of a fifth, much deeper stage of sleep. An unknown, lurking underneath our experience, gatekeeping the door to our dreams. In that fundamental dark something played tricks with our consciousness. ??

Traditional scientific knowledge describes it as a form of flow; a cyclic sea; our brain waves calmly moving through neurons as we lose ourselves to the deep. But these dragons broke those waves, crashing through, forming a whirlpool that Paul found himself to have seen before. He obsessed everything into a new experiment; pooling resources into a modified detector from his days researching quantum mechanics. As he steered this ship through this realm of data, something creeped up inside him, stirring forth a nauseating possibility. Like a splinter in his mind, something wasn’t right about what he had witnessed. The similarities with his previous work was too aligned. How the waves broke up and collapsed, how they formed anew, how they erased. Almost like… ??

For months, these dragons haunted him. Sleep eluded him, and sustenance became a distant concern. He was followed by a truth he couldn’t stomach, and least of all share. Believing himself saved from his obsession by an arriving new patient; Riley, a shy teenager with severe narcolepsy disorder, he paused the project. Returning to the practice of treatment and all his daily old routines. ??

But as the graphs kept scrolling and Riley’s confused eyes yearned for Paul’s help he fell into despair. Seeing this kid fall asleep multiple times each hour, realizing the profound implications and horror it entailed. He couldn't endure it, couldn't cope with it… so he ended it.??

—??

”You lost me.” I admitted to Paul, still lost in memory.??

”The fifth stage wasn't a new level of sleep, another brain process or function of the body. I had the proof… but fortunately that’s all gone now.” He threw the photo of the burnt lab back onto the pile of documents. My confusion was palpable.??

”Have you ever had a near-death experience?” He asked. I shook my head.??

”I would call you lucky, even though that would be nonsense in this context.” ??

”Why is that?” I questioned.??

”Whenever someone goes through that experience, they’re technically dead. We rejoice, hug them and cry out our joy when they get revived. But they’re not who they were.” He paused, gauging my comprehension.??

”Since there’s no way we could measure their experience, we wouldn’t know. Humanity never built any machines to test what transpires deep down when people die and return to life… But that’s exactly what I did.” ??

”You mean… someone died?” I asked, taken aback? ?

”Everyone dies. All the time.” He affirmed, pausing to assess my capacity for understanding.??

”That was what we discovered. What the fifth stage really was.” ??

”You mean to say that people somehow die when they sleep? Why would that be such a big deal if we later wake up?” I ranted back. As if disappointed in my lack of insight his posture fell, seeking the right words for my lesser mind; arriving at what could only be described as a cold punctuation to everything said prior: ??

”We don’t.” His words echoed in the small room, the hard reverb poured something cold down my spine. ??

”Our individual experience, the one you and I have right now, the feeling of myself looking at you—the experience of being, seeing, touching, tasting, all of it—it ends. Our mind, our journey as the self, ourselves, plunges into a place where our continuity ceases, dies, then everything collapses into a new self. This new self forms within the same brain state that serves as a foundation as we flow forward like a newborn birthed into the dreams formed by our pre-existing memories. Reshaping itself into a continuation from all that preceded.” ??

In silent paralyzation it all dawned on me as I slowly connected the dots. A creeping panic that crawled through me like thousands of needles. Calmly he gestured towards his wall-markings.??

”All these deaths I’ve had, and all those deaths my future will experience. But… Riley, that poor child. Imagine the markings on his wall, all those lives lost in an hour… every hour.” I observed a change in his breathing, teeth clenching as he seemed haunted by his empathy and struggle for self-control. I took a few slow breaths. ??

”You destroyed all evidence because of this?” I asked. He turned and leaned forward staring into my eyes, marking his words:??

”Just imagine a world with this knowledge as our life experience.” He gathered together the documents in a nice ordered pile before a final form of mockery:??

”And you thought I cared about insurance?”??

—?

Now I’m here.

Staring at these strange words; some form of daily memoir making me numb. I filed Paul’s case as inconclusive; I have no reason to believe him, but equally, no reason not to. And I will never know.??

I experience the texture as my fingers glide over this notebook paper. Hearing the muffled traffic outside, a late night argument at some street corner. The scent of an empty coffee cup lingers in the air. The subtle pulsation of my heartbeat. My middle-aged eyes strain to pierce the darkness in this silent nocturnal atmosphere.??

Someone will remember these moments tomorrow. But it will not be me.??

Hearing my son breathing in the adjacent room, deeply immersed in his slumber, deep down in that calm pulsating ocean. I tried to bid farewell rather than good night, but how could he comprehend? Briefly he goes silent; then continues to breathe.??

I miss my lack of sleep. As my days were filled with thoughtless acts; my mindless living gave way to that insomniac curse. Now I’m cured, yet how can that be? This infernal knowledge that would burn the world, yet it made me free.

Comments (24)

ToothyMaw January 01, 2024 at 16:54 #867396
I saw it coming, mostly because I've had such thoughts about sleep myself. Still, it was decent. The infodump was necessary, I guess, but it didn't really explain anything as well as I would have liked. The horror vibes were cool.
unenlightened January 02, 2024 at 12:33 #867791
I have read a couple of stories about multiple deaths. Curiously, the foundation of this one is the negation of the identity of the one who supposedly dies each time, and yet the horror persists because we do not believe that the identity dies. Counting the number of times the narcoleptic dies is insane indeed, because by proven hypothesis, it is a different narcoleptic each time and each one dies once only.

But the horror persists, because I think I survive each death. Narrative identity contradicts itself in every case by means of its 'development' and 'transformation'. The thread on which the beads of memory and experience are strung is devoid of identity itself, but binds the time nonetheless into the prison of self. and the end is either just the end or it is not.

The neurobabble is reminiscent of a Philip K Dick story - a sop to 'scientific realism' and a mere afterthought to the exploration of the state of mind of paranoia.

javi2541997 January 02, 2024 at 12:59 #867805
Good story. Firstly, regarding the technique, it is well written, and I appreciate the spaces and separations in the dialogues. It is easy to follow the story, so the reading is comfortable. Again, as I said in previous stories, I like it when some contributors are brave enough to write a story in a first-person narrative. Even when the 'self' is included in conversations with other characters, it feels real and authentic. I didn't feel separated from the plot at any time.

On the other hand, although I am not very interested in this type of literature (at first glance I thought about Philip Dick and I see that other mates thought the same...) I think it is well constructed. I attempted to say that it can attract readers who are not familiarized with this genre. I thought I was not understanding anything when I interpreted that the main protagonist seemed to die many times, and he was kidnapped by depression. Fortunately, this is somehow something that others also understood. Big congrats to the author. I liked it.
Benkei January 02, 2024 at 13:23 #867811
I found the point underwhelming because there's no real death as we understand it. I was like "so what?". If it talks like a duck and sounds like one, what do I care about the fifth stage? And I don't.
ucarr January 02, 2024 at 17:31 #867931
It hovers along the cusp of noir and sci-fi, and that’s a potent mashup.

…turned my attention to the iPad glowing the perps profile.


The use of the verb here is beautifully visual and current.

Our situation has the sleuth confronting a mad scientist who believes he’s destined to die a thousand deaths; a case of being slain by the paper cuts of troubled sleep.

The info-dump delivers the upshot of what’s to be learned too quickly and too easily. The karmic regeneration of the individual soul asleep each night experienced consciously needs to be broken up with action showing the characters gradual arrival at this hard-won knowledge.

This feels like the start of a feature length narrative, so the writer needs to prod the imagination to start filling the holes with more gold such as what we have now.





Vera Mont January 03, 2024 at 04:58 #868195
It feels disjointed - at least three different stories, all centered on a hypothesis to which I cannot relate.
The writing is good; the characters are good, but the story just doesn't work for me.
Outlander January 06, 2024 at 11:06 #869566
Wow. I have to say this one was the first story (out of the 5-6 I cannot recall, perhaps due to being dead LOL) that actually intrigued me beyond the content and writing of it.

Though while it is a very deep plot surely this is nothing new per-se and could have easily been borrowed from a movie or book.

That said compounded by excellent writing and a thorough lengthy plot that is always on point and never leaves the reader with a sense of menial mental occupation or "struggle to continue reading", I have to say this is probably my favorite so far.
Outlander January 06, 2024 at 11:20 #869571
Quoting Noble Dust
Most of the building still stood firm, a dark slice where the roof had been, its surviving windows oozing a dark residue.


Quoting Noble Dust
As if disappointed in my lack of insight his posture fell, seeking the right words for my lesser mind; arriving at what could only be described as a cold punctuation to everything said prior:


My two favorite lines. The former out of vividness and ability to convey a literal image through mere words, and the latter, perhaps out of a personal familiarity that shifts between concession and agony, if nothing else.
Nils Loc January 06, 2024 at 19:20 #869680
The narrative transition, from first to third person, combined with the metaphorical exposition (dragons of the fifth stage) left me a bit muddled. Possibly contributes to sense of 'disjointedness' in story, as it doesn't add much to my understanding of this sleep phenomena. Maybe all insight is best left to Paul's explanation.

The first patient, who isn't Paul, gives credence to the of the reality of this fifth state, unless we could explain away a shared delusion as mere coincidence:

d14893:he gets violently defensive, blaming us for repeatedly killing him”


We've all mused over this idea before of an invisible transition between alternate lives in different forms.

Benkei has a point though, insofar as nothing really shifts for these folks every time they die, outside of intuiting this glitch in the matrix. It's a kind of discomforting eternal return to the same state. What kind of work now does this realization entail?

Nicely written, engaging, solid entry.

:party: :death: :flower:




Amity January 09, 2024 at 14:12 #870759
The Fifth Stage

Quoting Noble Dust
My weary eyes, my wandering mind. My temple losing its hold on reality, falling through the cracks of existence; a fight I will soon lose, surrendering to sleep.


What is meant by 'temple'? The temple of the mind, consciousness? A fight to hold on to the reality of the world. To stay awake and aware. To be. Why would falling asleep mean 'falling 'through the cracks of existence'? What exactly are these 'cracks' - a physical or mental separation, a space, an opening leading where? A nothingness or a somethingness.

Already there is a mystery to be cracked.

Quoting Noble Dust
In my specific vocation, you encounter a substantial number of curiosities [...] After twenty-something years of this path, I believe myself to have gathered somewhat of a conscience. Or at least a reason for this infernal insomnia.
The irony then; to find myself in the serenity of these late hours. Why? Why this sense of tranquility after acquiring a knowledge that would grind all of civilization into dust?


We have a summary of the present situation; the character's belief about self but also questioning his state of mind. Good cliff hanger. What knowledge, where and how was it found and did it really entail civilisation being ground to dust?

Then a flashback. Quoting Noble Dust
A wave of déjà vu flowed through me as I presented my credentials as an insurance investigator to the tired receptionist at the mental hospital.[...]
I interrupted and expressed a simple truth. That this particular ward had not discharged a single patient in decades. He was given two options; either live with sanity in prison or remain to perform insanity for even longer.


The narrator has been here before. He knows the score. A strange knowledge that over a long period of time, this ward has never discharged a single patient. That can only be true in another reality.
Is he lying to the 'fool' to close the case quickly? Or does he believe the 2 choices presented?
Is this an abuse of power? He likes to crack people and cases. Quickly. Like a win against time.
Perhaps before he falls asleep...

Walking along the corridor, to investigate another patient, another time?, the narrator experiences a symptom of narcolepsy.

Quoting Noble Dust
”I can prescribe something for that.” The doctor suggested as my microsleep faded away


***

Quoting NHS - Narcolepsy
The length of time a sleep attack lasts will vary from person to person. Some people will only have "microsleeps" lasting a few seconds, whereas others may fall asleep for several minutes.

If narcolepsy is not well controlled, sleep attacks may happen several times a day.


***

The tiny windows; cracks into the cracks of the cracked.

Quoting Noble Dust
Tiny windows hinted fragments of broken individuals as I pondered about the experience of a disintegrating reality to such serious degree. It stirred me nauseous.


He moves between intellectualising to waves of sleep and back again. We can almost feel the disorientation and dizziness. Nausea. Sartre's existentialism.

The patient:
Quoting Noble Dust
”The initial report mentioned him in a catatonic state. Car collided with a parking pole near the beach, and police found him gazing at the rising sun, unable to communicate.” The doctor explained as we arrived at a specific door.


Perhaps another victim of narcolepsy. Cataplexy or sleep-paralysis. Quoting Noble Dust
I peered through the limited view through the small window. It revealed a curled-up man in the corner of his bed, dressed in unremarkable all light blue.


The narrator wonders about the danger of suicide, given the doctor's diagnoses of depression and paranoia. [Note - there can be comorbidity with narcolepsy]

Quoting Noble Dust
For the diagnosis I’m leaning against, there should be notable signs of it, but it seems every time we try to calm him down with any substances, he gets violently defensive, blaming us for repeatedly killing him”


The patient doesn't want to die. But apparently, he does... every time he is sedated. He fights this.
He ain't no fool.

And then there is another break. To another time and patient, apparently.
Quoting Noble Dust
”I want you to investigate an oddity.” My boss stressed over the phone. It was still early and dark as I kissed my sleeping son goodbye.


***

Quoting Vera Mont
It feels disjointed - at least three different stories, all centered on a hypothesis to which I cannot relate.
The writing is good; the characters are good, but the story just doesn't work for me.


It is disjointed. I think that's the idea. Still to get to this Fifth Stage.
Later...





















Amity January 09, 2024 at 16:07 #870770
The 'oddballer' is given another 'oddity' to investigate. Looks like another easy one:

Quoting Noble Dust
”Pretty cut and dry, our guy botched his parking, went inside and torched the place. Would have needed access codes and ID card considering the fire started deep in the labs with all the equipment and documents gathered in a large pile. We’re about 109 percent sure who did it.” I took in the scenery. Most of the building still stood firm, a dark slice where the roof had been, its surviving windows oozing a dark residue.


Love the crack of '109% sure'. Also the description of the damaged building. A temple of the mind with its roof taken off. A dark residue oozing through the cracks. Mind blowing brain substance. But recoverable.
Yes: Quoting Noble Dust
”Some laboratory, neuroscience kind of stuff,


Who would want to burn the place down? A mad man, a scientist turned mad with discovery. Of what?
OK. The Fifth Stage. Is it real?

Quoting Noble Dust
The swirling aroma from the busy kitchen filled the air with a hunger-inducing texture, if it hadn’t been for the stench of grilled plastic wafting through the entrance door. I texted my son to remember locking the door before school and turned my attention to the iPad glowing the perps profile.


The author is a sadist. We smell and taste the yumminess, then hit by chemical acrid poison. It doesn't seem to affect oddballer. He eats, texts and reads, attracted by the glowing enlightenment of technology.
His son seems to be alone in the house. No wife or mother around? There's a sense of loneliness.

Quoting Noble Dust
He was a smart one; Paul, the owner. Wrote a paper on quantum mechanics, some collapsing functions beyond my realm of understanding. Moved into neuroscience and sleep research, later bought the place 15 years ago with the help of private investors. All paid back by his treatment contributions to big pharma.


The author pulls us nearer to the 5th Stage. Paul has become rich by tapping resources of the powerful and being paid for using big brand drugs. But his intentions are good, right? He wouldn't keep patients as guinea pigs against their will, would he? To prove his Earth-shattering hypothesis.

Cue more backstory. Including his obsession and the reason for his breakdown.
An oddness found in screeds of neurological data and graphs. Circled in red but with a strange warning beside it. A blast from the past: Here be dragons. Don't go there... but Paul did.
And then a kid called Riley broke him.

I think I'm slipping beyond care now...it's too much...

Quoting Noble Dust
”All these deaths I’ve had, and all those deaths my future will experience. But… Riley, that poor child. Imagine the markings on his wall, all those lives lost in an hour… every hour.” I observed a change in his breathing, teeth clenching as he seemed haunted by his empathy and struggle for self-control. I took a few slow breaths.


OK. Riley has severe narcolepsy disorder. This story of a Fifth Stage hinges on this?
There are no deaths or rebirths as someone else. This is stupid stuff.
But the narrator seems convinced. He suffers from narcolepsy. What is the effect of this so-called knowledge. What is it? A collapse into nothingness?
From the beginning:Quoting Noble Dust
...that would grind all of civilization into dust


Quoting Noble Dust
I filed Paul’s case as inconclusive; I have no reason to believe him, but equally, no reason not to. And I will never know.


Quoting Noble Dust
Someone will remember these moments tomorrow. But it will not be me.


Quoting Noble Dust
I miss my lack of sleep. As my days were filled with thoughtless acts; my mindless living gave way to that insomniac curse. Now I’m cured, yet how can that be? This infernal knowledge that would burn the world, yet it made me free.


He is awake. Cured by the knowledge that he will die?

And all because of blip in a graph.

***

I enjoyed this story. It made me think and feel and wonder a little more about the mind. Very well written and even though I feel a bit sick, I'll give it a 5. Congrats!




























Amity January 09, 2024 at 16:26 #870778
And: Is there really a son? Or is this a hallucination?
It's quite, quite mad. The cracks in time and space. Mental.
Has this unreliable narrator been a patient - a specimen in this institution? Riley? Nah.
Intriguing... :chin:
hypericin January 14, 2024 at 00:04 #872099
If this were my story I would have spent a lot of time trying to figure out how to make the premise philosophically plausible. As it stands, it is a literalization of the philosophical puzzle of personal continuity over time. Can this puzzle be resolved by readings on a graph? So while I enjoyed the premise, it also made me roll my eyes a bit.

I liked the noir atmosphere, I think this was the strongest aspect, the writing captured this feel well. What I didn't like as much was the writing in general. The writer aspired to evocative language. But unlike some of the other readers, I was constantly stumbling over odd, awkward phrasings, sentences and paragraphs. Some hard polish in this area would have yielded a stronger piece.

Still a very good effort. I rate a 3.5, rounded up to 4.
L'éléphant January 14, 2024 at 02:57 #872117
It was a promising write -- but the point of the story (the fifth stage) landed flat because now it became a debatable point between the author and the reader. And I know as a reader that my response to it is "So what?" because "death" in this sense is just a dramatic way of calling the deepest sleep. The word I'm looking for to describe the focal point of the story is not "unconvincing", rather it was "uninspiring".

I gave it a 3.

Score to date: 37
Jack Cummins January 14, 2024 at 13:51 #872197
I found this story to be an interesting read, especially as I have worked in psychiatric nursing. This seems a glimpse of the American system, with insurance being critical, which is very different from the psychiatric system in England.

What I particularly liked was the way philosophy musings were incorporated, including the field of neuroscience and the phenomena of near death experiences. This particular blending of fiction and ideas may be an important direction in the form of creative non fiction and, in philosophy writing beyond the academic framework.
Christoffer January 17, 2024 at 18:37 #873023
First up a thank you to all who commented on this, I appreciate any feedback I can get and the time you took to engage yourself in it! :fire: :cheer:

Quoting ToothyMaw
I saw it coming, mostly because I've had such thoughts about sleep myself. Still, it was decent. The infodump was necessary, I guess, but it didn't really explain anything as well as I would have liked. The horror vibes were cool.


Thanks, yeah, the info dump is an unfortunate need in order to keep it within the length limits, I was always on exactly 3000 words :sweat: so getting a lot of info across is a challenge. And the horror vibes, only after I wrote it did I realize that it's basically a lovecraft story, dreams, forbidden knowledge, broken mental states and a mental institution. With something more fleshed out it would have fit right into that mythology in a way, even through it's more science based.

Quoting unenlightened
The neurobabble is reminiscent of a Philip K Dick story - a sop to 'scientific realism' and a mere afterthought to the exploration of the state of mind of paranoia.


It's interesting when some personal favorites show up in comments as it speaks to which mindset I exist within when thinking about storytelling.

Quoting javi2541997
I like it when some contributors are brave enough to write a story in a first-person narrative. Even when the 'self' is included in conversations with other characters, it feels real and authentic. I didn't feel separated from the plot at any time.


Thanks! I think I chose this because of the kind of horror setting it ends up in. A subjective perspective usually functions well for tension and horror compared to third person. It especially makes it easier to describe reactions when length is tight.

Quoting Benkei
I found the point underwhelming because there's no real death as we understand it. I was like "so what?". If it talks like a duck and sounds like one, what do I care about the fifth stage? And I don't.


Quoting Vera Mont
It feels disjointed - at least three different stories, all centered on a hypothesis to which I cannot relate.
The writing is good; the characters are good, but the story just doesn't work for me.


Quoting Nils Loc
The narrative transition, from first to third person, combined with the metaphorical exposition (dragons of the fifth stage) left me a bit muddled. Possibly contributes to sense of 'disjointedness' in story, as it doesn't add much to my understanding of this sleep phenomena. Maybe all insight is best left to Paul's explanation.


Quoting Nils Loc
Benkei has a point though, insofar as nothing really shifts for these folks every time they die, outside of intuiting this glitch in the matrix. It's a kind of discomforting eternal return to the same state. What kind of work now does this realization entail?


Quoting L'éléphant
And I know as a reader that my response to it is "So what?" because "death" in this sense is just a dramatic way of calling the deepest sleep.


I think that this might be the reason it didn't score higher or connected with all people. It's either that it didn't communicate enough about what that death really means or that some people have another idea about death and it gets in the way of that point. Either way, I think the concept in itself is a hit or miss because of this.

The main point is that death in that stage "ends you". As in; you, as a person, only experience life between waking up and the next sleep cycle, and so you believe that you have this entire continuation of life behind you through your memories, but it all ends when you go to sleep, you will not continue after that. The next day "another you" wakes up with all the memories, believing they've existed their entire lives, but then, they too will stop existing the next time they go into deep sleep.

Basically, it wasn't really a story about that revelation specifically, but a notion of what the consequences of such knowledge would do to people. That's the thing I thought were the interesting part, not so much the point itself.

It also created a problem in that; how do you write this concept in a way that doesn't just become pure exposition, and it may have made it problematic to perhaps communicate the exact nature of the revelation as it's not just "death" as we look at it, but a discontinuation of the self. So, in answer to @Nils Loc about the "muddiness" of "dragons" and such, it became a balance between the poetry of the text and the science, trying to find a more interesting way to write that infodump.

But hopefully you all enjoyed it beside this point and got something out of it, and thanks for the feedback! It helps narrowing down the parts that didn't work.

Quoting ucarr
The info-dump delivers the upshot of what’s to be learned too quickly and too easily. The karmic regeneration of the individual soul asleep each night experienced consciously needs to be broken up with action showing the characters gradual arrival at this hard-won knowledge.


Yeah, I think so too. It's the length limit that screwed with that part. I was trying to figure out how to extend everything, but then it just ended up being only that section without any backstory or character parts. So I absolutely get what you mean about it being too quickly. I actually wanted the last part to be much more, the consequence of the knowledge is more interesting than the knowledge itself.

Quoting Outlander
Wow. I have to say this one was the first story (out of the 5-6 I cannot recall, perhaps due to being dead LOL) that actually intrigued me beyond the content and writing of it.

Though while it is a very deep plot surely this is nothing new per-se and could have easily been borrowed from a movie or book.

That said compounded by excellent writing and a thorough lengthy plot that is always on point and never leaves the reader with a sense of menial mental occupation or "struggle to continue reading", I have to say this is probably my favorite so far.


Super thanks for this! It's a challenge writing in your second language so any praises on the writing craft is really nice to hear! :cheer:

Reply to Amity

I won't attempt to answer any of that because I think your reactions and interpretations needs to exist in its own realm. You read it in that perfect middle place between author intention and reader interpretation and I think that's where stories has their home. Thank you so much for the detailed write-through of your reactions to the story, they are invaluable as a source for growth for a writer! :fire:

Quoting hypericin
What I didn't like as much was the writing in general. The writer aspired to evocative language. But unlike some of the other readers, I was constantly stumbling over odd, awkward phrasings, sentences and paragraphs. Some hard polish in this area would have yielded a stronger piece.


I think that's because I know how to write in English like I'm doing now, but prose is another beast to master in another language. Getting the poetry of a text correct is a challenge and I get that you are the one to criticize this in my story since your story were pretty flawless in that regard, at least in my opinion. English has a totally other dictionary for colorful and dramatic writing.

Quoting Jack Cummins
I found this story to be an interesting read, especially as I have worked in psychiatric nursing. This seems a glimpse of the American system, with insurance being critical, which is very different from the psychiatric system in England.

What I particularly liked was the way philosophy musings were incorporated, including the field of neuroscience and the phenomena of near death experiences. This particular blending of fiction and ideas may be an important direction in the form of creative non fiction and, in philosophy writing beyond the academic framework.


The philosophical part I felt was appropriate for a story on this forum, so that was totally correct. Interesting with your background with psychiatric nursing, I didn't do much research I'm afraid so I hope I nailed some sense of realism to that part. I wouldn't want it to feel like the bad old inaccurate rendition of how it is within such halls that Hollywood usually makes, but still have some of the horror feel that is felt when witnessing people with severe breakdowns in their sense of reality. Thanks!
Amity January 17, 2024 at 19:18 #873048
Quoting Christoffer
?Amity

I won't attempt to answer any of that because I think your reactions and interpretations needs to exist in its own realm. You read it in that perfect middle place between author intention and reader interpretation and I think that's where stories has their home. Thank you so much for the detailed write-through of your reactions to the story, they are invaluable as a source for growth for a writer! :fire:


I wouldn't expect you to answer all of my comments :wink:
Glad you found them useful. Appreciate the feedback to me and the rest of the gang. :sparkle:
Noble Dust January 18, 2024 at 00:30 #873188
@Christoffer I don't know that I ever commented on your story, so I apologize. I liked the sort of mystery-to-be-solved setting to start out, but think I had trouble finding my way through the narrative. I can tell you put a lot of work into this, though, which I appreciate, and as someone who is also fascinated by dreams and tales of out-of-body experiences, and as someone with sleep paralysis, this type of story will aways hold my attention. :ok:
Christoffer January 18, 2024 at 15:15 #873325
Quoting Noble Dust
but think I had trouble finding my way through the narrative.


Thanks for the feedback, was there anything in particular that made it troublesome to move through it?
Christoffer January 18, 2024 at 15:17 #873326
Did an AI render as an atmospheric cover :smile:

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Christoffer January 18, 2024 at 17:05 #873355
Another good one

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hypericin January 18, 2024 at 19:07 #873419
Quoting Christoffer
I think that's because I know how to write in English like I'm doing now, but prose is another beast to master in another language. Getting the poetry of a text correct is a challenge and I get that you are the one to criticize this in my story since your story were pretty flawless in that regard, at least in my opinion.


I didn't realize, usually I try to make allowances for that. Writing in English already uses every bit of my linguistic ability, writing in another language is just madness!

Quoting Christoffer
English has a totally other dictionary for colorful and dramatic writing.

Yes! As every high school student learns to their dismay. It is interesting, one is almost prohibited from uttering such words out loud, on pain of being branded pretentious. I was a precocious reader, and didn't figure this out until late :lol: . Does Swedish(?) have the same?

I was wondering what your background was in working with fiction?

Quoting Christoffer
The main point is that death in that stage "ends you". As in; you, as a person, only experience life between waking up and the next sleep cycle, and so you believe that you have this entire continuation of life behind you through your memories, but it all ends when you go to sleep, you will not continue after that. The next day "another you" wakes up with all the memories, believing they've existed their entire lives, but then, they too will stop existing the next time they go into deep sleep.


I appreciated the overtly philosophical subject matter. My issue was, how could a scientific instrument reveal this? I once had a similar idea for a story, involving Star Trek style teleporters. They become ubiquitous, and the holdouts watch in horror as their friends and loved ones routinely murder themselves. At least here a clear philosophical case can be made, that teleportation is indistinguishable from destruction of the body, and reconstitution of a clone at some other place and time. Perhaps the company advertised that the bodies are dematerialized and transported through space, but this proves to be a lie: the old bodies are just dumpstered, and new ones synthesized from a broth. Employees are caught messing with the old people after their bodies are scanned, maybe raping the attractive ones, before they are killed, and crucially after the new ones are synthesized. :chin: This would realize some of the paradoxes in the literature, in a fun way.

Quoting Christoffer
Basically, it wasn't really a story about that revelation specifically, but a notion of what the consequences of such knowledge would do to people. That's the thing I thought were the interesting part, not so much the point itself.

Its really an open question. Assuming this was conclusively determined, would people panic? Or, lacking any experiential difference, would they shrug their shoulders and move on with their (discontinuous) lives?




Christoffer January 20, 2024 at 16:09 #873944
Quoting hypericin
writing in another language is just madness!


I read a lot of English literature so that helps. Sometimes I actually feel my Swedish is lacking more when writing, but it could be that I feel English has more options to "paint" a text.

Fun fact I read somewhere; your first language is usually more emotionally driven while your second language is often better for logic and reasoning. Maybe it's because people learn their native tongue through the emotional journey of childhood and everyday life while the second language is usually learned within halls focused on knowledge and logic (schools), and later business.

Quoting hypericin
Does Swedish(?) have the same?


It's similar, but English has more words. Maybe it's due to the Shakespearean era and evolution of the language in literature. But Sweden has a long history of literature as well, so I'm not sure. I'm no expert in linguistics, but when vikings ruled over a lot of Great Britain, the old norse spread into the English language. There are many words that are basically the same between English and Swedish (and other nordic nations except Finland).

A good way to demonstrate is through the days: "Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday".

As an example, "Thur" is basically the god Thor and the "s" at the end is how we distinguish something as its "owner". So "Thursday" is basically some form of Anglo-Saxon word for "Thor's day". Thor in Swedish is "Tor" and with the "s" after it and "dag" meaning "day", the Swedish word for Thursday becomes "Torsdag"

So days in Swedish is: "Måndag, Tisdag, Onsdag, Torsdag, Fredag, Lördag, Söndag"
"å" sounds like "o" but with less "a" in it, and "ö" is like saying "uhm" without the "m". So, "Måndag" basically sounds the same in english "Monday". "Mån" I think is from the god "Måne" meaning "moon" so, "Moonday". "Tisdag", "Tuesday" is named after the god "Tyr" pronounced "Ti" in old Swedish. "Wednesday" is a bit tricky since it's from 'day of Woden' in Anglo-Saxon's merging of old norse and English. "Woden" is basically "Odin" and in Swedish the day is "Onsdag" "Odin's day". "Friday" is "Fredag", "Frigg's day" or "Frey's day" meaning Freya. And "Sunday" is "Sun's day" and basically the same in Swedish with "Söndag" which sounds almost the same, however "Sön" is an old word for the sun which today is "Sol".

"Saturday" seems to be the odd one out which shows how English borrowed some but not all. In Swedish, "Saturday" is "Lördag". "Lör" comes from "Löga" which is an old word for bathing, but not used in modern Swedish. But in English it's instead taken from Saturn. Maybe because it's the only day that's not a day linked to an old norse god and instead a tradition of the day you took a bath. I can imagine the Anglo-Saxons just being "nope", not gonna reference our hygiene to a specific day, let's take something Roman :sweat:

Quoting hypericin
I was wondering what your background was in working with fiction?


I've worked with theatre and film primarily. But I've been thinking of writing my own stuff and I'm trying to dip my toes into it. It's different working on other's stories and doing it yourself. It's easier to interpret something already there than to interpret what's in my head.

Quoting hypericin
My issue was, how could a scientific instrument reveal this? I once had a similar idea for a story, involving Star Trek style teleporters. They become ubiquitous, and the holdouts watch in horror as their friends and loved ones routinely murder themselves.


Yeah, that was the fiction part of the Sci-Fi. I tried to hint at Paul's quantum mechanical background in which he saw correlations between how the wave function collapses and how the brain states collapsed and how they ended the continuation of the old state; but it's impossible to go so far as to have it scientifically viable. I think I'm more interested in the implications of such a find than it's scientific plausibility or the plausibility of us being able to find answers to such a thing. But I think it's better to have some method on display in the story as a solution than "Paul put the patient in a box and the box's AI said it was so" :sweat:

I actually wrote in another thread about a similar concept. It's basically the teleportation problem that this story is centered around. Like sleep being the transportation and the one going in ends and the one coming out has no idea they "died", only believing in their continuation due to their memories being consistent with that experience. I had an old story concept that was also similar; about a society in which teleportation had taken over as the major transportational system of the world, reshaping cities to not have roads or any other infrastructure left; but an error in one person's life when transporting himself revealed that there's something off and it pushed him to discover a conspiracy and coverup of how teleporters actually work and how they basically just kill everyone who uses them, just making a copy on the receiving end and forcing everyone to walk and invent new (old) ways of traveling.

Quoting hypericin
Its really an open question. Assuming this was conclusively determined, would people panic? Or, lacking any experiential difference, would they shrug their shoulders and move on with their (discontinuous) lives?


Yeah, that's the open note I wanted to end on. We have two people, Paul and the narrator and while the narrator still have doubts he's basically believing what Paul said to him. And they both kind of are two sides of the spectrum of reactions, the narrator had trouble sleeping, now he's fine with it after learning this knowledge. Like, some twisted form of tranquility. While Paul is in a mental institution because he can't cope with himself dying over and over.

But I think Paul is right about one thing, that if we, by some miracle, found conclusive evidence that this was the case and the world learned about it; it would probably collapse society. If you only had a day to experience in life, would you really do anything to plan for tomorrow? For years to come? For others in society? It would be the madness of the ego; desperate to survive and have some quality in experience before an early death. In contrast to the teleportation problem, sleep cannot be avoided, so it would be a blanket of terror over everyone.

I tend to gravitate towards concepts like this, minor discoveries or events that can have enormous consequences. I think it comes from my interest in science and how many small, seemingly insignificant discoveries reshaped the world around us in ways that's unprecedented in our civilization's history.

Let an AI make a "book cover" by analyzing the story, ended up kinda nice.

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hypericin January 23, 2024 at 02:40 #874721
Quoting Christoffer
It's similar, but English has more words. Maybe it's due to the Shakespearean era and evolution of the language in literature.


English frankly has too many words, far more than any individual actually knows. But it does give you an extraordinary palette to work with. I think it is due to the diverse influences and conquests of England, combined with the widespread adoption of printing and dictionaries. Without these, most of the words would have sloughed off the language a long time ago.

Quoting Christoffer
A good way to demonstrate is through the days: "Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday".


Thanks for the fantastic explanation. I actually partially figured this out before. I think while high, lol.

I couldn't make sense of Tuesday and Wednesday, and wtf was Saturn doing there? I wondered.

Quoting Christoffer
I actually wrote in another thread about a similar concept. It's basically the teleportation problem that this story is centered around.

I was going to say, we should start a thread, and there it is.

Quoting Christoffer
Let an AI make a "book cover" by analyzing the story, ended up kinda nice.


Very nice, which did you use? I want to see what it comes up with with mine.