Humour in philosophy - where is it?
If I could have studied under anyone at all I think it would have been Sidney Morgenbesser. His proposed response to Heidegger's ontological query "Why is there something rather than nothing?" was "And if there were nothing? You'd still be complaining!" Or possibly Lewis Carroll: “I’m sure my memory only works one way,” Alice remarked. “I can’t remember things before they happen.” Echoes of Wittgenstein who said [citation needed] that a serious and good philosophical work could be written that would consist entirely of jokes.
The question is: what's happened to humour in philosophy? In Maths we have the great stand-up mathematician Matt Parker. We have stand up for the Classics with Natalie Haynes. And the Map Men do a great job for geography. It's odd that we don't - or do we? - is this just my ignorance? - have a stand up philosopher. Especially seeing that the images used in philosophy are often so hilarious, even without heckling from a club audience. I mean, brains in vats and fat men on bridges and kidnapped women hooked up to famous violinists and planets with water that isn't water. It's like a combination of a 1950's horror movie, a Laurel and Hardy short and a rejected Netflix pitch. It's also amazingly serious and excites profound emotion. A couple of the examples I just gave are dealing with life and death matters of moral responsibility. This would seem fertile ground for a culture in which serious matters are allowed intelligent and witty airing. Why is philosophy lagging behind?
The question is: what's happened to humour in philosophy? In Maths we have the great stand-up mathematician Matt Parker. We have stand up for the Classics with Natalie Haynes. And the Map Men do a great job for geography. It's odd that we don't - or do we? - is this just my ignorance? - have a stand up philosopher. Especially seeing that the images used in philosophy are often so hilarious, even without heckling from a club audience. I mean, brains in vats and fat men on bridges and kidnapped women hooked up to famous violinists and planets with water that isn't water. It's like a combination of a 1950's horror movie, a Laurel and Hardy short and a rejected Netflix pitch. It's also amazingly serious and excites profound emotion. A couple of the examples I just gave are dealing with life and death matters of moral responsibility. This would seem fertile ground for a culture in which serious matters are allowed intelligent and witty airing. Why is philosophy lagging behind?
Comments (36)
During the first waves of the corona pandemic he recogded a series of podcasts, called "Civilisation, the Aftertoughts". The dutch word is is 'nabeschouwing' which is unfortunately hard to translate but it is what sports analysts do when they comment on a game after it has been played. He also acts like that a little, giving commentary on the game.
I think it is a good combination actually. humour helps us cope in practice with the absurdity of existence and jokes confront us with missmatches between our idealized world of aims, ideas and endeavours and the every day stumbling and fooling around we engage in in practice.
Humour is extremely important in life and without it everything can become so heavy and dull, especially with all the big philosophy questions. I know that on a daily basis I have to be careful not to lose humour. Perhaps, laughing at at absurdities is possible and, it may be preferable to be able to laugh at oneself rather than others, to avoid causing offence. Maybe, life is a complex mixture of tragedy and comedy.
The funniest of the funniest are contradictions! :chin: Is Wittgenstein taking a swipe at philosophers who take their line of work (too) seriously.
P.S. Contradictions are hilarious when others do it. When you do it, it ain't funny, it hurts like hell!
[quote=Tao Te Ching]When a superior man hears of the Tao,
he immediately begins to embody it.
When an average man hears of the Tao,
he half believes it, half doubts it.
When a foolish man hears of the Tao,
he laughs out loud.
If he didn't laugh,
it wouldn't be the Tao.[/quote]
What about Democritus, the laughing philosopher (cf. Heraclitus, the weeping philosopher). My take on the two diametrically opposite reactions to life and reality is that Democritus wasn't laughing because life is funny, he was laughing because life is sad and Heraclitus wasn't crying because life is sad, he was crying because life is a funny.
Vide infra (from the thread: Play: What is it? How to do it?)
Quoting TheMadFool
Quoting Athena
If philosophy is a joke, the punchline would be...Sophia doesn't love you back dear! :smile:
I think a case can be made that stand-up comedians in general are philosophers. My favorites; Bill Burr, Louis C.K, John Mulaney, Jerry Seinfeld....; certainly are.
If you're looking for philosophical humor, I'll steer you toward one of my favorite threads - "Philosophy joke of the day."
Quoting T Clark
:up:
Quoting TheMadFool
I didn't realize till this quip, Fool, you're a closet-
Spinozist! How absurd.
:up:
:grin:
( ... )
[i]Groucho Marx
Lenny Bruce
Richard Prior
Woody Allen
George Carlin
Robin Williams
John Cleese
Rowan Atkinson
Bill Hicks
Bernie Mac
Dave Chappell
Bill Burr[/i]
That right there just fucking nails it! :rofl:
But philosophers don't all believe that our existence is absurd; in fact, many, if not most, don't.
As for the mismatch: If anything, philosophers are trying to make sense of it, not bemoan it and joke about it like third-class moralizing busybodies.
Maybe. I personally dislike most stand up comedy, so I'm out. :groan:
:ok:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfduUFF_i1A
My feelings exactly until a new breed of stand-up appeared which consists of very witty treatment of serious subjects - basically, excellent lectures. I mentioned maths, Classics and geography, there are probably more. If 'stand-up' calls to mind some guy wittering on about his flatmate's bathroom habits then I agree, but there's more to it than that, I promise.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSifxC_L9F0
Loved it!! I hadn't known. Thanks for showing it!
Yes. It's hard to talk about philosophical humor, or humorous philosophy, without bringing this out.
It's not just the material, it's the form. And I have no sense of humour. I find comedians generally too needy for love or hectoring bores.
And miserable. So miserable.
When it eventually comes out that such and such comedian is depressed, or committed suicide, somehow, it's not a surprise. What is surprising is that so many people don't seem to see the signs early on -- the dropping corners of the comedian's mouth when they smile, the sad eyes, the conspicuous hyperoptimism.
Just as true, or more so, of philosophers and wannabe philosophers.
And don't even talk to me about actors....
:100:
The comedian aside, what of the joy they bring to others? Is the audience no different than a crowd in Rome, taking delight in watching others die? I don't think so. I think it is more like those who appreciate a painting or sculpture who may be aware the artist has a tortured soul.
As another digression, I love watching the crowd during a stand-up routine, particularly attractive women caught in unguarded, selfless, mirth. Indeed, even the not-so attractive become more so. I don't know why. Have to ask Freud or some shrink. :grin:
The trope of the sad clown is one of those unfortunate truths about humor. I tend to see the funny side of real things rather than contrived things. I can't do comedy movies or any kind of sitcom either. I find Nietzsche amusing in places ("In heaven all the interesting people are missing.") and he may well have been a riot in person. But I am not a deep reader of his oeuvre and I can't help feeling that if he had just been more successful with women he might have been a very different style of writer.
I just googled philosophy cartoon and there was some fun. Not all, but some.
I'm sorry to break this news, Tom Storm, but that may be the first step on a road to becoming a stand-up comedian. The second step is wanting to share it with everyone. You're almost there - despite yourself... :wink:
I find Existential Comics to be laugh out loud funny on a regular basis. Here is Camus Teaches Elementary School.
I donate money through Patreon and I would encourage all readers/participants of TPF to do likewise. It's a helpful antidote to the intense seriousness of many of these discussions.
A simple remark: It's quite weird that you brought up Wittgenstein in relation to humor! He's one of the most tragic figures I have ever seen in philosophy! The guy was highly depressive. (You can easily see that in almost all of his photos, while reading his statement "a serious and good philosophical work could be written that would consist entirely of jokes"! This is a joke in itself!)
Quoting Cuthbert
I think the same thing that has happened to all sectors in life: politics, science, etc. Except maybe in stand-up comedy and comedy movies (romantic and pure comedies), but even there, humor has deteriorated. Compare, e.g. comedy movies of the first half of the 20th c. with the those of today. I certainly laugh much more with old comedies. Of course, quality was a much strong criterion for a movie to get into the market than it is now. Abundance destroys quality. Maybe the same happens with philosophy.
So, I don't know if philosophers suffer from lack of humor more than other professions. Doctors, for instance, are horrible when comes to humor. Usually, they don't even respond to humor. They are too "tight". Lawyers are a little "looser". Teachers: Looking back in my school and college period, I can find a handful only of teachers that could be called humorous. Too tight too. Most politicians are too serious. And so on.
Then, humor of course is quite subjective. So, one has to do a survey, asking people: "Has humor been diminished or deteriorated in relation to the past?" If this is true for most people (to a marked degree), then one can safely accept it as a fact.
Anyway, the only way to preserve humor is to keep it alive! :smile:
"What do Nihilists have to say about Nihilism? If it was not for Nihilism, they would have nothing to believe in."
:lol: