Janus

if you accept that there is a fact of the matter regarding well-being, and it's true that Americans are among those with the greatest lack of well-bei...

Well I would say there are facts about what constitutes well-being for any person or even organism. There are also facts about who thinks which human ...

Regardless of whether there is free will, whatever that is taken to mean, it is obvious that moral thinking goes on, from which it follows that there ...

No I don't think that. As I said I think there are facts of the matter re human well-being.

Solipsism obviously isn't true, so...

Why should there be such an option, when it patently does exist.

I think there is an inherent logic in moral thought. In other words I think it is a fact that moral concern is at its basis concern for the well-being...

The problem with your argument here is that it fails to recognize that the Christian notion of flourishing is an eternalist, not a temporalist, one. O...

If you were to follow the anarcho-primitivist, you would say that the modern lifestyle is immoral, based as it is on private property and exploitation...

One of the central anarcho-primitivist claims (embodied in the very name!) is that anthropological and paleontological evidence suggests that hunter-g...

You can join the anarcho-primitivists in thinking that the only viable future for humanity is a return to hunter gatherer life. However they work with...

That may be what the OP says, but it is not what I would say. I would say that moral thinking is driven by concern for human flourishing; so that conc...

Sure you can call it an explanation, but it is not really much of a one. A proper explanation would not merely identify what is going on, but explain ...

Yes, it's one thing to say that morality is basically concerned with human flourishing, and another thing entirely to identify just what that flourish...

The point I'm making is that it's not a thesis, but an identification of underlying logic. It's not so much meant to explain anything as it is merely ...

I don't know about the OP, but I would say that it is simply an attempt to identity the basic logic underlying moral thinking. And it would not be the...

It depends on whether a person would be miserable without indulging in those things. There is always a tradeoff.

I think it's more because such an act shows the person to be concerned with themselves more than others. The act hurts those who love the suiciding pe...

OK, but I'm trying to drill down further; what does a virtuous person generally look like to the common eye? Cruel, indifferent, manipulating, exploit...

:ok: Gotta go...

Well we don't need to be able to give a precise definition of fuzzy words of course, but that is self-evident in the definition of such words.

I didn't say you are fun to play with except in public. I only get to play with you in public!

Sure, 'shrub' and 'tree' are words which shade into one another; but by no means all words or even most, or even perhaps many, words are like that.

Oh, I would have said that characteristic is more prevalent among the smarter and more interesting (which is of course not to say that all those who a...

Are you suggesting the majority of people think in terms of virtue? If so then how do you think they represent virtue to themselves? Are you suggestin...

They are by no means alone in that!

How would that work? Providing a definition of familiar objects is not difficult. It may be more difficult to provide definitions for various emotions...

I would say that we know the definitions of many words, and that we come to know the definitions of words that we don't yet know the definition of, in...

"Best model" then or "preferable model"? Yes, but the question then is 'what is it about the way Aragorn is that makes you want to be like him?". It's...

I don't think so. What I'm trying to point out is that all those virtues you mention basically consist in caring about others, and of course oneself (...

To say that virtue ethics is the right model for moral thought and action is the same as to say that we should be virtuous, no? I doubt it given that ...

Nice story! But my point was that when you say you are moving towards virtue, you must have some idea what it is, no? If asked I might say that to be ...

No, but to know what is moral in a given instance is to know what is virtuous in that instance, by mere definition. I can't see a difference between t...

How do we determine what is virtuous?

Not only climate change refugees, but the poor in general. The project to bring the world's poor up to what we in the prosperous nations would conside...

So, where are we to place our moral priorities if a conflict of interest concerning the flourishing of present humans vs the flourishing of future hum...

I think you're preaching to the deaf. I already made the same point and it was ignored.

As I see it the discussion is not about conscious individual purposes, but concerns the implicit logic of moral thinking.

This seems to allude to what I think is a most important point. If a tribe thinks their actions which are detrimental to other tribes are morally just...

Right, and as long as their tribe remains isolated from the rest of humanity, then their actions may be judged as to whether they serve human flourish...

I think the point here would be to consider human flourishing in both the widest, i.e. global, and the narrowest, i.e. individual, contexts. Leaving t...

Is the corollary of this that actions which do facilitate human flourishing are moral, and those which hinder human flourishing are immoral?

It's not a rule, but an absolute absence of rules. :wink:

That privileging seems to be a "natural" outcome of symbolic culture; that coupled with the fact that all social species seem to cleave to their own. ...

I agree; I am by no means certain about how things will unfold either. I don't privilege humans over all the other species, though; and I'd rather see...

I think exploitation, and even persecution, of minorities is inevitable under the current system, because there isn't perceived to be enough to go aro...

You are eloquent as always, apokrisis, and I agree with you that what will be will be. I think the green movement has been unsuccessful because the pr...

I still don't know what your point is.

You are just projecting your modern mindset here in asking for "solutions". Look at social animals: they cooperate and don't go about murdering one an...

It seems almost certain that we would not collectively and voluntarily make such an attempt. However if the current system collapses humans may well r...