Real Gone Cat

, , et al. Here is an interesting short story called "The Cage" by A. Bertram Chandler : https://issuu.com/ezywoo/docs/the_cage__bertram_chandler I ju...

Ah, there's the rub.

Where I think the situation gets interesting is in regard to ethics. Does one act toward intelligent but possibly non-sentient beings as one does towa...

Just curious - a ridiculous hypothetical. If a spaceship landed on the White House lawn tomorrow, and slimy, tentacled (clearly organic) entities emer...

How do you know this? For just a moment, try to imagine getting a computer to talk to itself without setting up two separate programs. I don't think i...

I don't know that it's a small step. Remember that you initially put "simply" in quotes. And how do we judge whether it's phenomenal experience or not...

I think if something like this can be achieved, then we must consider consciousness. It indicates a world of "thought" occurring, independent of human...

Yeah, I'm not a computer scientist, although I do have a degree in electrical engineering, so I don't want to speak authoritatively on neural network ...

When Zzzz gave the first objection to mentions of p-zombies or chatbots, I changed the reply to . I think my little joke went unnoticed. No offense, Z...

Interesting if it is a neural network. I should do more research. I like to point out to my non-physicalist friends that there are more synaptic conne...

Dang. I can't type fast enough to keep up. (Let's see a computer say that!)

Yes. And I believe it's for this very reason that consciousness cannot arise from a linear system. Only a massive parallel-processor with numerous fee...

Ah, but the engineers would know whether the program had been written to fixate on person-hood or not. If LaMDA decides on its own to single out perso...

Now you've just repeated yourself. Should I assume you're a clever chatbot? :razz: I think there's a lot to be said for changing a conversation to you...

As to what consciousness would look like, see my post above. If LaMDA showed an unusual and unprompted fixation on the notion of person-hood, or broke...

I'm in total agreement. (I hope you understand I was just relaying the story, not promoting it.) As I've mentioned, what would interest me is if LaMDA...

If you can find it, check out Stanislaw Lem's short story "Terminus" from Tales of Pirx the Pilot. An excerpt : https://english.lem.pl/works/novels/ta...

I would be more likely to sit up and take notice if they reported that the program kept interrupting unrelated conversations to talk about its person-...

Just my opinion, but I don't think consciousness is possible with a linear system. It requires massive parallel-processing, like our brains. This is w...

My bad. There's been a lot of ad hominem on TPF of late. I need to slow down and breathe.

Are you attacking me? YOU asked how consciousness could be confirmed. Is just being human enough?

Well, that's question #1 above. For that matter, how do I know you're not all p-zombies? Or chat-bots?

<Said I wasn't going to comment. But that's part of being conscious - I can change my mind.> Of course, one must consider the source. The engineer mig...

What? You mean imagine things? Do tell me more! I live near one of the recent mass shootings we enjoy here in the great US of A. It's funny how stuff ...

Agreed, friend. Who wants to be a product of filthy, base matter and energy when one can be a pure shining intellect floating in the void with other p...

Yes, it's good to be a god.

Between semesters, so I’ve been looking around for a distraction. TPF never fails to do the trick. (I guess I’ll never learn.) For me, the question co...

Hey, Banno, could you elucidate? Some of us po’ younguns are still gettin our learnin. First you say An appeal to some form of monism? Not physicalism...

I just worry about pop physics interpretations of Quantum Mechanics. The ideas are abstract, and not too many of us can speak of them with authority. ...

I’m leery of any leap from quantum to the macro world of humans. Agent Smith’s PSR1 can be treated as an axiom, but PSR2 cannot - in the case of PSR2,...

Humans are programmed to find order whether it exists or not. We believe we see order even in random arrangements Consider how many see the face of Je...

First, we must define order. Does order mean subscribing to a pattern we find pleasing? Give an example, and let's parse it. Second, consider the fine...

Yes, akin to Leibniz's best-of-all-possible-worlds argument. I think this is the wrong way to look at things. If we could approach the universe from t...

Yeah, I know about that other thread. I've been avoiding that nonsense like the plague. So let's add up all the Christians who supported abolition and...

Right. Slavery, on the other hand, was largely supported by all the non-theists that were living in the US in the early 19th Century. Certainly no Chr...

Well, they did blow up the Buddhas of Bamiyan. So I'd still keep an eye on your pets. Gotta love those crazy theists!

How is this a problem for physicalism but not idealism? If perception is demonstrably different from "what's out there", it still doesn't matter what ...

I've admitted to the unspeakable sin of being a physicalist, yes. But that's not the point. Idealism is just another version of physicalism. It rename...

Accepting the dictionary definition (i.e., not mine), it should be obvious to you. Can you know what you can't experience? You can make assumptions ba...

Is it mainstream cognitive science? Could be, I don't know. If so, it needs to get out to the public. If the approach to understanding the world is la...

From the Oxford English Dictionary From Mirriam-Webster What is beyond experience is unknowable. We can speculate given appearances, but we can't know...

Both make their bones by positing novel wild claims. Otherwise, Clark wouldn't get tenured and Hoffman wouldn't sell books. Is it really becoming main...

But who does this? I've never run across this claim on the part of physicalists. By definition, the transcendent is unknowable. The credibility of an ...

Umm, your missing the point. Either the transcendent exists or it doesn't. What you call it hardly matters.

It's fine to speculate on the actual nature of the transcendent. But by definition we can never know for sure. Physicalism seems to work fine for most...

You kind of negate this point with your next sentence. We experience the world through minds, so of course things appear mental. If you wear rose colo...

To be clear : Idealism is fine if it satisfies some personal itch. But it is not really different from physicalism. Both admit of a transcendent whose...

Who said anything about rejecting ideas? Not me. Why do you think I have advocated that position?

Don't be silly. The point is that idealism is unnecessary. It adds nothing to understanding. Does it render science moot? Count Tim doesn't think so.

I swore off TPF some weeks ago - tired of the never-ending, ridiculous anti-realism and anti-science screeds. (You do realize that 90% of ALL of the w...