Bob Ross

Allowing for evil is necessary when creating a good world. A world with natural laws allows for natural evil; a world with persons allows for person e...

Dignity is relative to the nature of a thing; and I would argue you are implicitly using it to determine how wrong an act is (and the justice system d...

I would suggest you read my explanation of the requirement for sacrifice I gave to @"frank": you are also misunderstanding the point. It's about synth...

A quick google search also shows a lot of arguments against capital punishment by Christians. Is your critique of retribution that it is too harsh? In...

You never provided a definition of murder: I am still waiting to hear it. Your defense of my charge of God committing murder is that no one can commit...

Yes, so your argument is from Divine Hiddenness. This assumes that it is better for God to reveal Himself constantly to people throughout history than...

Not quite. As I mentioned to another person on this thread:

Can you elaborate on this? I am thinking Christianity, the herd morality, is what is abolishing it. We don't have the stomach to kill people anymore.

We don’t have to start with the question of whether God exists to decipher God exists. Aristotle just wanted to explain change… Also, theology is a br...

Yes, and they were wrong. We don’t need to reject God’s existence to accept that that was wrong. We don’t even need to reject Jesus to accept that. Th...

Not all of it, but, yes, retribution is about restoring the dignity of the offended. Wouldn’t you agree? When some woman gets raped, a price must be p...

I appreciate your thoughts! Firstly, endorsing a law that does not protect against certain evil is not the same as endorsing a law that protects evil....

I don’t see why that would be the case. Although maybe you are getting at a divine hiddenness objection. I see why you see an issue; but there is none...

Well, I'm not an expert either. I see what you are saying: it is hard to interpret the texts. They seem disparate.

I would say Catholics and Orthodox Christians accept that not everyone is equal in heaven. There are plenty of refences in the NT to Jesus talking abo...

I don't think so, but Protestants would tend to agree with you.

CC: @"Banno" Punishment to the offender is not per se necessary: the final end of justice is bringing everything under the proper respect of the order...

:up: Feel free to let me know your thoughts on Biblical slavery.

I may have missed something: I apologize. I still don’t see the relevance of: Given Jesus failed to address the OT’s mistakes and given him referring ...

That’s an argument from external incoherence for the Bible; but that has no relevance to frank’s OP: they are asking about why God would sacrifice Him...

Yes, I was providing a common Christian view to why Jesus had to die: I wasn't commenting on if I am a Christian or not. I clarified that to @"frank" ...

No we don't need to talk about it: all you need to concede is that there are some legitimate sins; then God would have to incarnate himself through hy...

BANNO. @"frank" ignored the Thomistic response I gave: even if you don't think that kind of response will be received as plausible by frank, they didn...

Cc: @"Banno" @"frank" :up: I can tell now that neither of them want to have a productive conversation: they just want to straw man and desecrate on th...

Then you need to refurbish your position. You said that God does not murder because when he kills us we don't truly die. This applies to all killings ...

You just continue to be disingenuous. I'm done talking to you.

I wouldn't answer because it is irrelevant; but ok, I'll answer to further the discussion. I don't believe Jesus is the Son of God. This is irrelevant...

@"frank" wrote in the OP: Don't you agree this is a straw man? The Catholic Church does not teach this nor is it an iron-manned position on the topic....

You didn't just read it, frank, you ignored it and responded to low hanging fruits. I've given you many opportunities to engage and you refuse, which ...

When we discuss hypotheticals, they are in a vacuum: they are ceteris paribus. We add in variables to test our reasoning and decipher what we believe....

I don't see the relevance: can you elaborate on how this relevant to the OP? Let me grant you that Jesus relates himself to the messiah from the OT wh...

Ok, thank you for the clarification. If you are using my definition and leveraging that God is not murdering people because they can't truly die, then...

My invocation of Thomism here was to give @"Frank" a reasonable Christian answer to their OP's blatant straw manning of Christianity; which doesn't ne...

I was talking about legitimate debt. Are you suggesting that the idea of sin is illegitimate?

You are making my point for me! In my example I am right that they are innocent because they are morally blameless as it relates to the incident; wher...

I didn't give a reference for that because I do not see the relevance. The OP is arguing that the OT depicts God in a light that is contradictory to G...

You are just shifting the goal post to a discussion about what constitutes innocence. There is a wide consensus that unjust acts involve a victim and ...

I don't think that is true. God may indirectly intentionally kill people or let them die; but He does not directly intentionally kill people (notwiths...

It was an account through natural theology of why God would necessarily freely choose to sacrifice the Son (which doesn't necessarily have to be Jesus...

Yep, that's why it has been historical seen as immoral and has been illegal. Same with assisted suicide. If you don't agree with the definition, then ...

Because the OT claims God has done things that are evil; and God cannot do evil.

As I tried to explain to @"frank" (but they rudely ignored it), it is because God is all-just. To forgo the repayment required for an offense is to fo...

GregW, murder is the direct intentional killing of an innocent person and a killing is to end the natural life of a being. By your logic, then, if I g...

No, I wouldn’t. But let’s say I did: is your argument that if it is immoral to kill or leave the infant, then the lesser of the two evils (that should...

I have not. I haven't had the time to sift through all the posts in here.

There was nothing invalid about the form of my argument. Murder is the direct intentional killing of an innocent person. God did that in the OT, or ra...

Yes, but you are thinking of liberty of indifference and not liberty for excellence; and this is why you will find it incoherent and probably downrigh...

I literally responded with a philosophical account of why God had to sacrifice Himself, devoid of faith, and @"Frank" ignored it. I understand many la...

How is that relevant to our discussion? Do you see how your depiction of Christianity was a straw man? That's all I was attempting to argue here.

I explained this in my responses to you: And: But you didn’t address them. Your view is a straw man of Christianity. God is all-just and all-merciful;...