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On the Relationship Between Belief and Action

Pinprick May 19, 2020 at 22:53 6375 views 12 comments
I’m have several questions regarding belief and action, so it may be easier to just list them out.

1. Are actions caused be beliefs? In some cases, perhaps more than some, the answer is obviously yes. We intentionally perform a certain action because we believe it will achieve the result we desire. However, there are other times when our actions seem to contradict our beliefs. What can we conclude from this? Are the beliefs that we take for granted as being permanent and unchanging actually very fluid so that in certain circumstances we change our minds and believe the opposite, and therefore act in such a way?

2. Are we always aware of our beliefs? We may think we believe in the golden rule, but maybe we really don’t. Isn’t it possible that the social pressure to believe a certain statement is so great, and that our entire construct of the world, sense of self, morality, etc. is so dependent upon believing this statement that our subconscious will not allow our true belief to rise to the surface of consciousness? Much in the same way that cognitive dissonance affects our behavior?

3. Could our actions cause our beliefs? Could it be that we generally behave in a very thoughtless manner (seems rather obvious to me), and that we form beliefs post hoc based on our actions? We may, again subconsciously, be aware that we act a certain way, and therefore conclude that we hold a belief that is consistent with our actions.

Comments (12)

The Wu Way May 21, 2020 at 17:17 #414717
I guess its important to understand how we determine what our beliefs are in the first place.

How would you respond if I asked you to tell me your beliefs about a controversial topic such as abortion or gay marriage or immigration?

Would your answer be the same or different if you were narrating this response to your family, or if you were giving an interview on CNN, as opposed to posting it on a discussion board. Or perhaps the determinant is the course of action you take when you find one of this issues at your very own doorstep. Or maybe yet still it is the innermost private thoughts you hold, or even the deep feelings that you do not even know exist within you.

The possibility, and i would suggest, more likely, the probability of contrasting responses in these situations begs the question of which do you take to be your fundamental belief or does such a thing even exist?






DingoJones May 21, 2020 at 17:31 #414721
Reply to Pinprick

Its cognitive dissonance. Human behaviour doesnt always make sense unfortunately.
Frank Apisa May 21, 2020 at 17:37 #414722
Quoting Pinprick
We may think we believe in the golden rule,


Of all the idiomatic indulgences used in a philosophical forum...the term "believe in" is the most needlessly over-used. It exacerbates fogging up the problems being discussed rather than helping to make them more clear.

Do you "believe in" democracy?

Do you "believe in" God?

Do you "believe in" the Golden Rule?

Wouldn't a more specific phrasing be better? For the three examples above:

Do you prefer a democratic state over a totalitarian one?

Would you guess that at least one god exists; do you guess that no gods exist; or do you not make a guess on the question?

Are you inclined to treat people the way you would like to be treated by others...or do you think that notion to be intrusive or unworthy in some way?

Even the use of the words "believe" or "belief" is over-used...a kind of lazy way of saying what we actually mean.
Pinprick May 21, 2020 at 21:19 #414793
Quoting DingoJones
Its cognitive dissonance.


What are you referring to here?

Quoting DingoJones
Human behaviour doesnt always make sense unfortunately.


Right, but it should be explainable, right?
Pinprick May 21, 2020 at 21:27 #414796
Quoting Frank Apisa
Do you prefer a democratic state over a totalitarian one?


Whatever your preference is, it’s based on a belief you have. The reason you prefer one over the other is because you believe one to have better qualities than the other.

Quoting Frank Apisa
Would you guess that at least one god exists; do you guess that no gods exist; or do you not make a guess on the question?


This actually seems more complicated than simply asking if you believe in God or not.

Quoting Frank Apisa
Are you inclined to treat people the way you would like to be treated by others...or do you think that notion to be intrusive or unworthy in some way?


How you actually treat people may be different than how you believe they should be treated, and that’s what I’m getting at.

Quoting Frank Apisa
Even the use of the words "believe" or "belief" is over-used...a kind of lazy way of saying what we actually mean.


There’s no hidden meaning in what I’m saying. I’m talking strictly about beliefs, as separate from actions, feelings, etc.
DingoJones May 21, 2020 at 21:28 #414797
Reply to Pinprick

Its a psychological term, holding two opposing ideas to be true at the same time, or consistently acting contrary to one or more beliefs.
Explainable given sufficient knowledge yes, of course.
Pinprick May 21, 2020 at 21:31 #414798
Reply to DingoJones I know what cognitive dissonance is. I meant what in the OP are you attempting to explain using it? Do you not think that we have the necessary knowledge needed to explain our behaviors, either our own, or others?
DingoJones May 21, 2020 at 23:03 #414812
Reply to Pinprick

I think the 3 things you described are part of the natural result of cognitive dissonance. The blurred lines that you are asking about between contradicting belief and action are cognitive dissonance in action.
Banno May 21, 2020 at 23:17 #414813
Reply to Pinprick Curious how when beliefs are mentioned, some folk go for the big stuff - Quoting Frank Apisa
Do you "believe in" democracy?

Do you "believe in" God?

Do you "believe in" the Golden Rule?


Quoting The Wu Way
abortion or gay marriage or immigration?


Meh. That's mostly irrelevant to the argument.

You wanted to light the room
You believed that flicking the switch would light the room
Therefore you flicked the switch.

And the question is did your belief cause you to flick the switch?

Offhand, that's one of Davidson's approaches. And it seems fine so far as it goes. The explanation given above is complete, since the question "why did you flick the switch?" has an adequate answer. SO talking in terms of beliefs causing actions is fine.

I take your second question to concern akrasia rather than cognitive dissonance. See the section on Davidson's approach. While suffering cognitive dissonance is having contradictory beliefs, akrasia is having consistent beliefs but acting irrational.

And for the third, yes, beliefs can be made post hoc.
The Wu Way May 22, 2020 at 10:59 #414947
Reply to Pinprick

Right, but it should be explainable, right?


Do you not think that we have the necessary knowledge needed to explain our behaviors, either our own, or others?


From a purely cause and effect perspective behaviour is entirely explainable:
I was hungry so I ate
It was dark so I switched on the lights
I was an only child so now I am an attention seeker

But from what I understand the root of your questions is 'what drives our behaviours?'. If that is the case then conscious beliefs are only one, potentially small, piece of the puzzle.

Pinprick May 22, 2020 at 16:36 #415015
Quoting DingoJones
I think the 3 things you described are part of the natural result of cognitive dissonance.


Well, in that case, I guess I would reframe my questions to be about what causes cognitive dissonance, and how can we tell when this is or isn’t occurring. But, so we’re clear, you’re agreeing that these things do occur (actions causing beliefs, beliefs causing actions, and lack of certainty of our beliefs)?
Pinprick May 22, 2020 at 16:58 #415021
Reply to Banno So the answer to 1 and 3 is sometimes? 2 is more about whether or not we can be certain about what we believe, and if so, how. Is it reasonable for me to evaluate my behavior and deduce my beliefs from that analysis? Vice versa? IOW’s when there is an apparent contradiction between what I think I believe and how I act, does that mean I’m wrong about what I think I believe, or did I just act irrationally? If the latter, then what would be the cause of my action? Perhaps a different, and contradictory, belief? An emotion/feeling? Some sort of limitation on my ability to act in accordance with my belief?

Consider this example:

1) I think I believe A.
2) Belief A entails act X.
3) I do act Y.
4) Act Y implies I believe B, which contradicts belief A.

Does this mean 1 is wrong? Is it possible to hold contradictory beliefs? Was 3 caused by something other than a belief?

This is somewhat of a personal question. I do not believe in free will, yet I act as if people are responsible for their actions. I’m a moral nihilist, but act as if good and bad exist. I suppose a follow up question would be should I try to change either my beliefs or actions so that they are consistent?