A question about certain sensitive threads.

Quoting Shawn

I posted a thread about why Israel sends their children to concentration camps at such a young age, and whether it is ethical to do so.

It got deleted by jamalrob pretty swiftly.

I kind of treat this forum as a Hyde Park of sorts; but, didn't think an honest and genuine question would get deleted and upon asking why given a command not to post it again.

So, what's up in your world, jamalrob?

I don't know alot about Israel. What are you talking about? I know they have forced conscription at adult hood for their military for 2 years.

Quoting Shawn

I posted a thread about why Israel sends their children to concentration camps at such a young age

:brow:

Had a look at the thread out of curiosity. If a random thought/question of no obvious philosophical import pops into your head, post it in the shoutbox.

Reply to Baden

Wow, that sounded really bad. Sorry. Let me reiterate. I started a thread asking why young students from Israel go to holocaust camps as an educational experience, at such a young age.

It got deleted, and was wondering why,

Reply to Shawn
Quoting Baden

If a random thought/question of no obvious philosophical import pops into your head, post it in the shoutbox.

Reply to Baden

Can you answer the question as to why my thread about that topic got deleted?

Reply to Shawn

Given my experience, I presume it was because it was a random thought/question of no obvious philosophical import. But feel free to wait for a response from jamalrob.

I got a private mail warning that I would get banned if I called a virus that originated in Voldemort, and information about which was suppressed by the Voldemort government the Voldmort virus. Because apparently that is racist. Go figure.

What exactly are the free speech limits here? Just determined on a whim by the admins?

Quoting Nobeernolife

Just determined on a whim by the admins?

Just determined by the admins and their moderate minions. did you think it was a free site? There's no such thing as a free site.

As to the whimsicality, I think they broadly follow a line of 'political correctness' as you would call it or 'common sense and decency' as I would call it, along with a certain bias towards being connected with the title of the site - ie Philosophy. Thus when a topic is both controversial and non-philosophical, it's best to get rid before rabies breaks out.

Reply to Nobeernolife

Read these. It will save us all time:

https://thephilosophyforum.com/discussion/480/site-guidelines

"The above guidelines are in place to help us maintain a high standard of discussion and debate, and they will be enforced.If you feel from the get-go that their very existence impinges on your right to free speech, this is probably not the place for you."

On the rest, already explained by PM:

"... the word "racism" can be used loosely for prejudice or antagonism against different nationalities, particularly when the different nationality happens to be of a different race.

...

Call it xenophobic if you want. This type of discourse results in reinforcing negative attitudes towards Chinese and Asians. So, when it's not the actual name of the virus, we will presume the change is being made for that reason."

Now this is not your feedback thread, and this has been explained anyway (twice now) so I'm not going to continue it with you.

Or as explained by Twitter:

Quoting unenlightened

Just determined by the admins and their moderate minions.

I'm not moderate.

Yeah he's an extreme minion!

I'm actually the only person who moderates here. Everyone else is just a decoy to share out user complaints.

Reply to Michael

Cool, you can have nobeer then. *Washes hands*.

Quoting StreetlightX

Or as explained by Twitter:

Wow...I needed that laugh this morning.

Thanks!

So, are we allowed to call the German measles the German measles, or is that racist?

Funny screenshot by the way. But isn´t that sexist, these days? I mean, with gender identity rights and all that...

Quoting Michael

I'm actually the only person who moderates here. Everyone else is just a decoy to share out user complaints

Oh, so you are "Baden"?

Reply to Nobeernolife If you haven’t got the intelligence to figure out that calling Covid the ‘Chinese Virus’ is less than acceptable so be it. I assumed you just slipped up and wasn’t thinking, maybe you’re just idiot. Nothing wrong with that, everyone’s an idiot sometimes.

Quoting I like sushi

If you haven’t got the intelligence to figure out that calling Covid the ‘Chinese Virus’ is less than acceptable

No I don´t. Is German measles racist? Yes or no?

Reply to Nobeernolife Bye

Spanish flu?

Japanese encyphelitis?

Lots of name-calling, but no answer.

The CCP strategists must be laughing their ass of, seeing how easy it is to control the Baizuo. Just shout the magic R word, and they fall in line.

Sorry @Shawn that your thread got hijacked. Apparently, @Michael is dealing with it.

@Nobeernolife why do you want to call it the Chinese virus so badly? It has a decided-upon name already, so use that.

In regard to 'Chinese Virus', and other racism. I am a peaceful man, but I don't see that same capacity in my enemy. I want peace with all, the flair of 'no I don't is just my perception of war. It is happening. The Chinese and Russian Governments have threatened us with war, do we leave it to the Govs or do we stand as a separate, people Government. I believe in politeness, so no racism, but aggression now in some cases is not only socially, but tactically may be beneficent (since threat).

Reply to wiyte

So like... don't be racist. But promote individual aggression ("don't leave it to the government") towards China and Russia based off a nebulous threat. And start talking about it in terms of the coronavirus. Riiight.

Well, I didn't mean to offend anyone personally.

I'm confused now. Who allegedly invented the coronavirus, was it the Chinese or the Russians?

That idea is prominent you are probably a tad racist for saying it, but I believe we need to be separate categories - so you can say this.

Reply to wiyte

You didn't offend me. You just wrote a bunch of nonsense.

Reply to fdrake it had some merit. You understood. So I guess it's just wrong.

Reply to wiyte

Understanding something does not, by itself, give it merit.

A joker I see.

Reply to wiyte

Nah, I think I took what you wrote more seriously than you did. :wink:

Nah... I'm not serious about it at all.

I was just subscribing.

Reply to wiyte

You're willing to promote individual aggression towards Chinese people and Russians for a joke?

Nah never.

They would have a beautiful death in war and same as in peace.

Quoting wiyte

They would have a beautiful death in war and same as in peace.

...

So now the aggression you promoted towards the Chinese and the Russians for the sole purposes of a joke is... Buttressed by a declaration that it doesn't matter how they die.

Not a joke because the prospect that we may be thrown into war is likely, I don't think some solitude with potential enemies is right now beneficent. People need an intellectual peace of strict good communications that's not what it is, that's what the Government are dealing with. I'm more in support of our Government. I am have peace made out of aggression because we have been threatened. Ties need to be mended in war areas.

Quoting wiyte

I don't think some solitude with potential enemies is right now beneficent.

Framing Chinese people and Russians as enemies.

Quoting wiyte

People need an intellectual peace of strict good communications that's not what it is, that's what the Government are dealing with.

Stating that the government (which, where?) are dealing with people being too PC towards people from other nations (characterised as threats/enemies).

Quoting wiyte

I am have peace made out of aggression because we have been threatened. Ties need to be mended in war areas.

And this is a problem because, you claim, other nations are a threat.

Quoting wiyte

I'm more in support of our Government.

But you obfuscated those claims by saying that you support a side (which you invented the characterisation of) by agreeing with the opinions you ascribe to it. Using a common phrase of national solidarity.

For some reason I don't think you are being honest about what you actually believe. :eyes:

I don't think the Chinese man is ugly, I don't want to neglect his life in any way. A Chinese Government and Russian Governments have publicly threatened war. I am not even trying to incite war, but have more social presence on the matter.

Quoting wiyte

do we leave it to the Govs or do we stand as a separate, people Government

Quoting wiyte

I am not even trying to incite war, but have more social presence on the matter.

No, promoting personal violence against foreigners is much more peaceful. Apparently.

Not that much aggression, questions, theories such as Chinese virus. Look at the topic.

Quoting Shawn

I posted a thread about why Israel sends their children to concentration camps at such a young age, and whether it is ethical to do so.

Quoting Shawn

I started a thread asking why young students from Israel go to holocaust camps as an educational experience, at such a young age.

It got deleted, and was wondering why,

This is actually sort of funny if you so poorly worded a question that it was understood as asking why Israelis systematically murdered their children when what you meant to ask was why Israelis educated their children about the horrors of the holocaust.

The idea is that through education we can be sure such a thing never happens again, and part of educating anyone is in telling them what actually happened. How detailed that discussion might be is probably something that is approached with sensitivity based upon the age of the child, which means I suspect that the educational program provided at the concentration camp would differ according to age. I would imagine it's also like here in the US. If I didn't want my kid to go to the holocaust museum on a class field trip, I'm sure I could opt out.

Reply to wiyte

And that's the start of the loop.. Not going around it a second time with you.

Thanks for allowing me to participate. That's moderation.

Reply to Nobeernolife

lol

Reply to Hanover

Yes, well. I did provide a small study to this matter. So, my concern wasn't with making a nation look bad or their policies towards the educational experience. It was born out of concern, since I visited such a place on my own.

Quoting Nobeernolife

I got a private mail warning that I would get banned if I called a virus that originated in Voldemort, and information about which was suppressed by the Voldemort government the Voldmort virus.

In the current local political climate (21st-Century Trumpiform politics) deploying the qualifier "Chinese" to describe a global pandemic is an act designed to inspire a xenophobic reaction. That should be obvious.

Out-of-context analogizing (German measles; Spanish flu) ignores the pointed niceties of the current climate. In the US, Calling Rubella the German Measles is harmless - in the sense that Germans are never denigrated or Cassandraed-about as the chief enemy of the United States, and anti-German racist sentiment is close to absent here.

In general, arguments from analogy are weak - forced, as they are, to pooh-pooh nuance and context.

Quoting Nobeernolife

What exactly are the free speech limits here? Just determined on a whim by the admins?

Ah, "free speech." Some think that by chanting the phrase any opinion expressed or statement made is allowed, and is justified. The "right of free speech" is a self-serving conceit, don't you think? I wonder how people came to believe they have such a right. Are the authors of the U.S. Constitution responsible for this phenomenon? Could they have guessed that by restricting the ability of government (and only the government) to limit freedom of speech they would encourage folk to believe they have the right to say anything, anywhere, anytime, regardless of its merit or worthiness? I don't think they can be blamed, not really. Who would expect people to make such an inference? Perhaps there's some other source for this delusion.

House rules. It seems quite simple.

Reply to Ciceronianus the White

Well put, sir.

Quoting ZzzoneiroCosm

In the current local political climate (21st-Century Trumpiform politics) deploying the qualifier "Chinese" to describe a global pandemic is an act designed to inspire a xenophobic reaction. That should be obvious.

Not only should it be OBVIOUS...it should be SOUNDLY CONDEMNED as well.

This is not the time for that kind of bullshit.

Thanks for speaking out about it.

Quoting Ciceronianus the White

House rules. It seems quite simple.

Yup!

Reply to Baden
Thank you.

Well, I agree that it shouldn't be called the Chinese virus. Here's a WHO statement put out in 2015 with their justification for avoiding such things.

https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/notes/2015/naming-new-diseases/en/

On the other hand we get these waves of demonizing nations, in media, by politicians, and then spreading through social media, compared to which calling it The Chinese Virus seems rather tame.

I guess I hope that everyone who is carefully monitoring the use of nations in disease names also carefully monitors where all the newsmedia demonizing aimed at a particular nation is coming from and why they become fads, and how wars often follow this.

So, like, cool, but jeez, I hope this care carries over into the really effective propaganda also.

Quoting ZzzoneiroCosm

Out-of-context analogizing (German measles; Spanish flu) ignores the pointed niceties of the current climate. In the US, Calling Rubella the German Measles is harmless - in the sense that Germans are never denigrated or Cassandraed-about as the chief enemy of the United States, and anti-German racist sentiment is close to absent here.

I can respect that it is offensive to some to call it a Chinese virus, so I don't do that. Where there is a disconnect with me here is that I don't sense in my community an anti-Chinese sentiment that goes beyond negativity towards their oppressive government. I truly don't feel any more negativity toward the average Chinese person than I do the average German person, but it's interesting to hear there is a growing prejudice against the Chinese in the US. I generally do have my finger on the pulse of American sentiment, and I've really not heard any Chinese person bashing, although the government is thought to be very dishonest and corrupt here. Of course, my bubble of interaction is limited, so maybe I'm not seeing something that Chinese Americans are experiencing often.

Quoting Nobeernolife

So, are we allowed to call the German measles the German measles, or is that racist?

It's actually not measles, so professionals call it by its proper name, rubella. You (hopefully) never got a MMGM (mumps, measles, German measles) vaccination, but an MMR (mumps, measles, rubella) one instead.

For a better comparison, it is generally considered bad form nowadays to call the influenza pandemic of 1918 "the Spanish flu".

Quoting Metaphysician Undercover

Who allegedly invented the coronavirus, was it the Chinese or the Russians?

According to now-banned user alcontali, it was probably oppressed Muslim supergenius bioengineers living in China giving the Chinese people what they deserved.

Quoting Hanover

Of course, my bubble of interaction is limited, so maybe I'm not seeing something that Chinese Americans are experiencing often.

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2020-04-01/coronavirus-anti-asian-discrimination-threats

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/apr/01/cathy-park-hong-minor-feelings


https://www.nbcnews.com/know-your-value/feature/nbc-s-vicky-nguyen-coronavirus-capitulating-anti-asian-racism-it-ncna1171926


https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/coronavirus/website-launches-to-document-anti-asian-hate-crimes-in-wake-of-covid-19/2258297/

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2020/03/coronavirus-covid19-xenophobia-racism/607816/