All this talk about Cogito Ergo Sum... what if Decartes and you guys are playing tricks on me?
It is true that I can only experience my own thoughts and not anyone else's.
And everyone claims that to be true for their own selves.
But what if the others are lying?
It is conceivable, and very easily unverifiable. Either way. For me. Because I can only experience my own thoughts.
So... all this bs about Cogito Ergo Sum could be just a wool over my eyes, by everyone else, or by one or more of the people other than myself, to fool me into believing that ALL and EACH person can only experience their own thoughts.
But that's not necessarily true. And it can't be proven or disproven to me.
So, what the...?
And everyone claims that to be true for their own selves.
But what if the others are lying?
It is conceivable, and very easily unverifiable. Either way. For me. Because I can only experience my own thoughts.
So... all this bs about Cogito Ergo Sum could be just a wool over my eyes, by everyone else, or by one or more of the people other than myself, to fool me into believing that ALL and EACH person can only experience their own thoughts.
But that's not necessarily true. And it can't be proven or disproven to me.
So, what the...?
Comments (9)
And what if you are lying?
Even if you were experiencing other people's thoughts, there still must be an entity that is experiencing. A consciousness, not necessarily a physical body.
Maybe I misunderstand the point you are trying to make.
Any thought truly shared by more than one person, and experienced therefore, is possible, and I have no way of verifying whether that happens or not.
It's like sharing a towel. If only you are able to experience a towel, you could declare, "I experience the towel, and therefore I am." If more than one people experience the towel, and they feel each other's experience with the towel, then they know what the others feel. Not just know, but experience.
Is it their own experience, and their own only? No. So if Peter uses the towel, and Fred experiences the drying feature of the towel, Fred can't declare "I am using a towel, therefore I exist", because he is not getting dry, he is just feeling the experience of another. On the other hand, Fred can declare "I experience the towel", and that can be a verification of his own existence for himself.
This is what it is. The big problem, of course, is that nobody knows if other people can and do share experiences or not. This is for those, who can only experience their own experiences.
Here’s my thing with Descartes’s cogito. How else would one go about evidencing that consciousness—the so called “I”—is not illusory? This since some philosophers make it a habit to claim that consciousness does not reference anything real, but is instead a reified notion.
But Descartes did not do that.
He finished his bath and went to bed.
in my model, it does not work that way. I believe you are thinking about verbal thoughts, which are even more problematic than non-verbal. In my model of thinking, the cognitive agent has mostly hierarchical, non-verbal linguistic structures that are framed and rooted in their own meaning of the experience as filtered/morphed by their personality filter. So, if another cognitive agent had access to, say, ‘thoughts’ in terms of the first non-verbal linguistic layer then their different personalities and historic experiences would evoke different historic meanings and access/qualia experiences so the two agents would not be “thinking” the same thing and their flow of consciousness would quickly diverge from each other so could not “experience themselves (and each other) as a single collective mind”. I’m very sure this would also be the case in the human brain model.