Optimism and Pessimism

Reply to Posty McPostface I am optimistic in terms of freedom and pessimistic in terms of the behavior and thoughts of other people.

Reply to Blue Lux

What do you mean by the behavior and thoughts of other people?

Reply to Posty McPostface Most people are devoid of philosophy. And this is troubling.

Quoting Blue Lux

Most people are devoid of philosophy. And this is troubling.

What's so great about philosophy?

Gramsci once called for an optimism of the will and a pessimism of the intellect: this has always been, I think, a lovely formula to live by.

Reply to Posty McPostface It don't like the term "realist" because everyone considers themselves to be a realist. Everyone's opinion is the "realistic" opinion or they wouldn't hold it. "Realism" is question-begging, in this context. Unless by "realism" it is meant "neither optimist nor pessimist ... but actually optimistic with a cynical flavor for the sex appeal."

In my opinion it seems like to even ask "is the glass half full or half empty" already basically confirms a pessimistic evaluation of the world. You'd think, that if the world really was good, it would be immediately obvious that it was.

Quoting StreetlightX

Gramsci once called for an optimism of the will and a pessimism of the intellect: this has always been, I think, a lovely formula to live by.

Indeed lovely.

Quoting darthbarracuda

In my opinion it seems like to even ask "is the glass half full or half empty" already basically confirms a pessimistic evaluation of the world. You'd think, that if the world really was good, it would be immediately obvious that it was.

Going back to realism, I think that's the only answer to the predicament posed by asking whether the glass is half empty or half full. At least that's the logical conclusion to stop oscillating between positivity or negativity over the issue.

Reply to Posty McPostface Philosophy can eradicate bigotry. Philosophy provides cohesion and understanding of humanity. Philosophy provides ethics.

Reply to Posty McPostface There's an element of "born with" for some people, but sometimes people learn pessimism or optimism too (e.g. from lots of failure or success).

Generally, the Buddhist analysis is good: our attitude to stuff can be divided into three directional tendencies - towards, away from, and indifferent.

Quoting Posty McPostface

We seem to hover around one of the two polar opposites that are optimism and pessimism. The reasoning goes, that some people are just born optimists or pessimists. But, then there are realists, that view the glass as both half empty and half full.

So, are you a pessimist or an optimist or a realist? Is there room for any more in that category? Maybe the fourth option is available here also? Such as a cynic who doesn't care or a stoic that also is indifferent?

From what I understand of the psychological research is that optimism is dispositional, so it's behaviour that you can learn. Optimism is what we do not what we are.

While on average optimism tends to be the attitude with improved long term outcomes (more successful, faster recovery from diseases, lower chance of depression) there are situations in which pessimism works better. For instance, "I better use sun block or I'll get skin cancer" is a pessimistic thought that will lead you to use sun block. The optimist will think "ah, just one day in the sun isn't going to make a difference". In the short term, defensive pessimism, that is in the sense of hedging your bets or preparing for the worst, is beneficial for coping strategy but the benefit appears to wear off over time (tested in relation to academic performance, people who expected bad grades even though they did well before are defensive pessimists).

That said. I'm an optimist in most situations and have a very positive outlook on people and their ability to flourish. I'm a pessimist with regard to the political and socio-economic systems in which we operate and feel we're unable to change them for the better.

Reply to darthbarracuda
:lol: :up:

A second post on optimistic and pessimistic philosophy.

Let's take as pessimism:

Schopenhauer (Die Welt, vol I, p 196):All willing springs from lack, from deficiency, and thus from suffering. Fulfillment brings this to an end; yet for one wish that is fulfilled there remain at least ten that are denied. Further, desiring lasts a long time, demands and requests go on to infinity, fulfillment is short and meted out sparingly. But even the final satisfaction itself is only apparent; the wish fulfilled at once makes way for a new one; the former is a known delusion, the latter a delusion not as yet known. No attained object of willing can give a satisfaction that lasts and no longer declines; but it is always like the alms thrown to a beggar, which reprieves him today so that his misery may be prolonged till tomorrow. Therefore, so long as our consciousness is filled by our will [which is as long as we are will-filled living beings], so long as we are given up to the throng of desires with its constant hopes and fears, so long as we are the subject of willing, we never obtain lasting happiness or peace. Essentially, it is all the same whether we pursue or flee, fear harm or aspire to enjoyment; care for the constantly demanding will, no matter in what form, continually fills and moves consciousness; but without peace and calm, true well-being is absolutely impossible.

At first glance, we can wonder whether there really is optimistic or pessimistic philosophy and not just a pessimistic outlook that informs philosophy. Second, the bolded part suggests Schopenhauer thought the purpose of life should be lasting happiness or peace, while at the same time holding the view there is no purpose to life. It's an interesting wish to have given his realisation.

What I think Schopenhauer misses is first of all that some willing is joyful. They're called dreams. Second, I can wish without having it being unfulfilled making me unhappy. For instance, I could wish they'd have better coffee at work but I'm perfectly fine walking to the coffee corner to get my shot of caffeïne. I don't really feel one way or the other about that. So there's wishing and Wishing. Third, I don't have time for worrying about the stuff I'm missing out on while I'm enjoying what I already have. Most of my waking life, I'm engrossed with the here and now as I'd argue most people in the world are. Fourth, fulfillment is not a goal but a process. While I'm working towards a goal, I'm enjoying myself. I'm enjoying myself while writing this post. It's not as if the enjoyment is only had at the point where I press "Post Comment". It's the same when I'm struggling to learn a new piano piece. I enjoy the struggle, I enjoy getting better, I enjoy reaching for the summit and being on the summit. So it's incorrect to say fulfillment is "short and meted out sparingly".

Philosophical pessimism in my view is nothing more than the product of an idle mind. Get a hobby.