The Socratic attitude and science.

Just recall the kinds of matters about which Socrates professed not to know. They were such questions as the nature of virtue, the nature of justice, and the nature of knowledge itself. None of which, I believe, are scientific questions, as such.

I often wonder what people 500, 2000, 5000 years ago did "know". Of course, a lot of what people know in any time is practical knowledge that works just fine. They may not have known where frogs came from 5,000 years ago, but then, they really didn't need to know, since the frogs took care of themselves.

People's heads have always been full of knowledge. Our heads (over the last few hundred years, for sure) have often been full of relatively useless knowledge. We have survival knowledge suitable to our time, but should things fall apart, we'd be up the crick. Of course, when things fell apart 5,000 years ago they were also up the crick (creek).

Quoting Posty McPostface

Then my question is, with the advent of science and all the various technological achievements, and the improvement in living standards and so on has the Socratic attitude become illogical or even detrimental to living in the modern day world?

No. Why? Problem of induction and black swan events.

Quoting Posty McPostface

with the advent of science and all the various technological achievements, and the improvement in living standards and so on has the Socratic attitude become illogical or even detrimental to living in the modern day world?

Quoting Wayfarer

Just recall the kinds of matters about which Socrates professed not to know. They were such questions as the nature of virtue, the nature of justice, and the nature of knowledge itself. None of which, I believe, are scientific questions, as such.

Socrates would be one of those who might ask "What is science?" in order to bring us to "What is not science?"
Seems VERY relevant to me and possibly those who follow Gwyneth Paltrow's exclamations.

And some others...
- What is a standard of living?
- What and whose "standards" are we using to mark improvement in these living standards? Are there some whose living standards have fallen in response to the increase in others?
- Is a technological achievement always an improvement in living standards?
- Is technology and science a necessary ingredient for "good living standards"? Or merely a contingent one?

Personally, I believe we need more of this sort of intercourse, not less of it.

Quoting Posty McPostface

Socrates is perhaps most famous for stating that he was knowledgeable about not knowing much or nothing.

If people know anything about Socrates, they know that. But what did he actually say, and where is it reported?

Quoting Uneducated Pleb

Socrates would be one of those who might ask "What is science?"

My first ever philosophy lecture was by a professor named Alan Chalmers, whose well-known book is called ‘What is this thing called science?’ Very well-known text, and recommended.

Quoting charleton

But what did [Socrates] actually say, and where is it reported?

I am wiser than this man, for neither of us appears to know anything great and good; but he fancies he knows something, although he knows nothing; whereas I, as I do not know anything, so I do not fancy I do. In this trifling particular, then, I appear to be wiser than he, because I do not fancy I know what I do not know.

I seem, then, in just this little thing to be wiser than this man at any rate, that what I do not know I do not think I know either.

Plato, Apology 21d.

I myself know nothing, except just a little, enough to extract an argument from another man who is wise and to receive it fairly.

Theaetetus, 161b

Socrates as quoted in Diogenes Laertius'Lives of Eminent Philosophers

?e knew nothing except just the fact of his ignorance.

Alternate translation:

I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance.

Reply to Posty McPostfaceIn Buddhism, ignorance is a prime evil as it leads to craving, a source of suffering. In Christianity (man was forbidden to eat from the tree of knowledge) it is a virtue as then innocence is preserved. Yes, I've simplified the matter but that's what Buddhism and Christianity essentially are.

The message being knowledge, per se, isn't always good for us. Don't we restrain children from some facts about the world. We need maturity or, if you prefer, wisdom to wield knowledge in the right way.

This can't be overemphasized in today's world, the so-called information age. We have to control information/knowledge because without wisdom it can be extremely dangerous.

As for Socrates I think he taught us a very important lesson - how to think rather than what to think. As a founding father of philosophy this teaching is his greatest legacy. Socrates gave us the key to knowledge, made explorers of us all.

Although I'm a beneficiary of that I question his wisdom in doing that. Isn't ignorance bliss?

“I know that I don’t know”
My take on this statement of Socrates is that it’s his reminder to consider the inherent limits of intellectual knowing. Intellectual arrogance can result in hubris. Another way to frame Socrates statement might be:
“We know by means of our intelligence that, what the intelligence does not comprehend is more real than what it does comprehend.” By Simone Weil

Quoting Wayfarer

I am wiser than this man, for neither of us appears to know anything great and good; but he fancies he knows something, although he knows nothing; whereas I, as I do not know anything, so I do not fancy I do. In this trifling particular, then, I appear to be wiser than he, because I do not fancy I know what I do not know.

OR..
“I am wiser than this man; for neither of us really knows anything fine and good, but this man thinks he knows something when he does not, whereas I, as I do not know anything, do not think I do either. I seem, then, in just this little thing to be wiser than this man at any rate, that what I do not know I do not think I know either.”

I seem, then, in just this little thing to be wiser than this man at any rate, that what I do not know I do not think I know either.

Plato, Apology 21d.

I myself know nothing, except just a little, enough to extract an argument from another man who is wise and to receive it fairly.

Theaetetus, 161b

Socrates as quoted in Diogenes Laertius'Lives of Eminent Philosophers

?e knew nothing except just the fact of his ignorance.

Alternate translation:

I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance.

And so we learn even without a reference to ancient Greek that Socrates did not actually say what he is commonly reported as saying.